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Thread: Do I really need a 6.5?

  1. #11
    XCR Guru ny32182's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    I don't have either yet, and consider them both to be a handloading-only proposition, so I see no reason not to go with the 6.5.

  2. #12
    Jack A Sol
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    I will admit that the 6.5 has some fantastic ballistics and is a very attractive cartridge. If one is handloading then there wont be a whole lot of difference between the 6.8 and 6.5. heck get both if you have the means!!

    my arguement only applies towards a combat cartridge use, and becomes largely irrelavant if one never plans on using it outside of a range or hunting or competition.

    I'm just so darn practical sometimes it's hard for me to see that less practical side of things :P

  3. #13
    XCR Guru MickeyC's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    There will be a huge difference. Look at the drag values for each bullet. Velocity may be similar out of the tube but the drag will determine the range capability.
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  5. #14
    Marksman johnny mac's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    Thanks for the replies. I forgot another aspect to consider, which is muzzle blast. It has taken 34 years, but I've finally smartened up about preserving my hearing. I've done plenty of shooting, listened to loud music, ridden motorcycles, and spent lots of time around loud machinery, all without proper hearing protection most of the time. Now I'm commited to protecting what I still have, and I use hearing protection whenever practical. In a hunting situation, hearing protection isn't always practical. I have an M1A Socom that nearly fills the bill for the do-everything rifle-it needs a good mount for standard optics in addition to the forward rail, and a riser on the stock to get a good cheek weld with optics of any sort. Both of these can be fixed, but I have made the mistake of firing it or standing next to it a couple of times without hearing protection, just for one shot. I will not do it again. The muzzle break is great at reducing recoil, but it is so loud that I think the damage to my hearing is unacceptable, even for one or two shots. I'm in CA, so a suppressor is not an option. How bad is the muzzle blast on the 6.8 out of a 16 or 14.5? And does anyone know how it compares to the 6.5? And a question for Terra-you said the 6.8 wouldn't be available any sooner than the 6.5. Does that include the conversion kit? I already have the rifle in 5.56. Jack, really good info on the ballistics/developement stuff. The adaptability and logistics aspects don't matter much to me, since in reality I (hopefully) won't ever have to use it for combat. I've got too many guns already that are overly specialized, I'm trying to settle on one gun to do it all-hunting, (reasonably) affordable plinking, carbine classes, etc. If I ever have to use it for serious business, I want it to be the gun that I shoot the most and am the most proficient with, and the first and maybe only gun I will grab at a minute's notice no matter what the job.

  6. #15
    Rifleman tinman's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    the debate of 6.5 vs 6.8 has been debated to death on different forums. they both were designed to do different things. 6.8 for combat ranges, 6.5 for longer ranges. how often will you be shooting at ranges past 300 yds? 600 yds? both are great rounds. pick one, shoot it, have fun. i have a grendel barrel on my encore. lots of fun to hit 8 inch metal plates at 350 yds. works fine on pigs at short ranges and hope to try it on deer this year. wolf ammo seems pretty cheap. will 6.8 work as well? you bet. so go try both if you can, then pick what you like best. ;D

  7. #16
    XCR Guru aziator's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    I can tell you that the muzzle blas on a 11" is pretty wild, but not much more than when the barrel was 16". it really isn't too bad though i did shoot 3 quick shots with it at a pig without hearing protection and was wishing I hadn't afterwards.
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  8. #17
    Jack A Sol
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyC View Post
    There will be a huge difference. Look at the drag values for each bullet. Velocity may be similar out of the tube but the drag will determine the range capability.
    I have included a PDF with grendel ballistics vs some other carts. you will notice that at 600 yards the difference between the 6.8 and 6.5 is that the 6.8 needs 1MOA more elevation correction. (115 6.8 vs the 123 6.5). I wouldnt call that a significant difference in any way. considering that most (prolly 99.9%) combat engagements are under 600 yards, there is no real advantage for choosing the 6.5 based on it's flight ballistics. The 115 OTM is at least a decent terminal performer comparitively.

    there is just not enough of an advantage for me ballistically, in the 6.5 to ignore the cheaper and more available and wider accepted 6.8.

    Once again, I will not deny that the 6.5 is a better long range round, but it's forte' is not combat cartridge.
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  9. #18
    XCR Guru gunner69's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    I wonder if the 6.5 MPC uses the 5.56/.223 case necked up? The trouble with using that case is lack of powder, in my opinion. My 6.5x284 is excellent for long range engagements BUT it isn't available in a semi-auto AR/XCR rifle yet. Of course I seldom need, have the opportunity, to shoot at over 600 meters anyway. :2cents: Too many variable at that distance for MOST of us. :2cents:
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  10. #19
    Marksman davek's Avatar
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    Quote Originally Posted by gunner69 View Post
    I wonder if the 6.5 MPC uses the 5.56/.223 case necked up? The trouble with using that case is lack of powder, in my opinion. My 6.5x284 is excellent for long range engagements BUT it isn't available in a semi-auto AR/XCR rifle yet. Of course I seldom need, have the opportunity, to shoot at over 600 meters anyway. :2cents: Too many variable at that distance for MOST of us. :2cents:
    The link I [posted above, http://www.defensereview.com/modules...rticle&sid=970, describes how the 6.5 MPC is made from the 5.56 cartridge case. SSK has the dies so you can make your own 6.5 MPC using 5.56 brass. One advantgae of this is that the same bolt is used for 6.5 MPC as 5.56, as well as the same mags, so only a barrel change is needed. I wonder if soemone could rebore an XCR 5.56 heavy barrel to 6.5 MPC?

    I sent SSK an email to see what they thought of reboring an XCR 5.56 heavy barrel to 6.5 MPC. I suspect it won't work because the shoulder is set back on the 6.5 MPC.

  11. #20
    QYV
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    Re: Do I really need a 6.5?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack A Sol View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MickeyC View Post
    There will be a huge difference. Look at the drag values for each bullet. Velocity may be similar out of the tube but the drag will determine the range capability.
    I have included a PDF with grendel ballistics vs some other carts. you will notice that at 600 yards the difference between the 6.8 and 6.5 is that the 6.8 needs 1MOA more elevation correction. (115 6.8 vs the 123 6.5). I wouldnt call that a significant difference in any way. considering that most (prolly 99.9%) combat engagements are under 600 yards, there is no real advantage for choosing the 6.5 based on it's flight ballistics. The 115 OTM is at least a decent terminal performer comparitively.

    there is just not enough of an advantage for me ballistically, in the 6.5 to ignore the cheaper and more available and wider accepted 6.8.

    Once again, I will not deny that the 6.5 is a better long range round, but it's forte' is not combat cartridge.
    Granted 6.8 and 6.5 are very similar at carbine range, and on paper both on superior to 5.56NATO. But it is much more interesting when you consider 6.5 vs. 7.62NATO and the potential as a DMR/sniper round. Looking at the numbers, 6.5 is capable of replacing both 5.56 and 7.62 NATO rounds, and that is something you cannot say about 6.8.

    Being that in reality neither 6.5 or 6.8 has been adopted the argument that 6.8 is cheaper and therefore preferable is very valid. But if/when one of these rounds IS adopted, that will no longer apply. And truly adoption of one of these cartridges is what will end up "deciding" which is "better".

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