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  1. #11
    Rifleman bgreed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomAiello View Post
    This is crazy. Everything in Idaho is business as usual.

    My wife is working in Arizona and I was supposed to take the kids down there to visit her this week, but I think we're going to have to delay until next week.

    I admit my sympathies largely lie with the protestors (not the rioters and looters) and definitely not the police. Police shouldn't be killing unarmed people who are in their custody, nor should they be shooting innocent people caught in no-knock warrants.

    Our police state is pretty much out of control, but I worry that this situation will only make it worse.


    Side note, I'm re-reading Henry Hazlitt's Economics in One Lesson, and it's interesting to see how many things he saw happening back in the 50s and how they've progressed today. I definitely recommend it for anyone willing to put up with his 1950's diction.
    Read Hazlitt in college (about a hundred years ago now) standard read besides him was Human Action by Ludwig VonMises and writings by Hayek.
    Yeah I attended that crazy little school known as Hillsdale College.


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  2. #12
    XCR Guru TomAiello's Avatar
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    Interesting article about police shootings, with referent to how police are trained:

    https://fee.org/articles/an-ex-cop-t...ice-shootings/
    Sean K. likes this.
    - Tom Aiello
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    ...I don't care, I'm still free, you can't take the sky from me...

  3. #13
    XCR Guru Sean K.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomAiello View Post
    Interesting article about police shootings, with referent to how police are trained:

    https://fee.org/articles/an-ex-cop-t...ice-shootings/


    The video of that shooting is infuriating. It's obvious the dude is drunk off his ass and is trying to pull up his pants that are falling down as he tries to crawl towards the officers.
    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human liberty. It is the argument of tyrants; the creed of slaves."-William Pitt the Younger

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  5. #14
    XCR Guru TomAiello's Avatar
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    It's amazing to me that so many people are ignoring that video (and that incident, really) in their desperate rush to paint this as a racial issue, rather than a police state issue.

    The 'us' and 'them' in this case are not segregated along racial lines. But it's politically convenient for many in power to pretend that they are.
    RobertSlaughter likes this.
    - Tom Aiello
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    ...I don't care, I'm still free, you can't take the sky from me...

  6. #15
    XCR Guru mjorin's Avatar
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    We had a protest in our small town of La Grande, OR tonight. Our town population is about 12,000. We had about 300 protesters. 100 locals and 200 bused in. I got the call and about 40 of us showed up armed. We stayed across the street. We were there just to make sure we had a town tomorrow and had a place to go to work tomorrow. I'm pretty pissed about people being bussed in. Mind your own damn business. It went smooth. No real problems, just as a real protest should be. The cops were super cool and appreciated the back up and several protesters came over to chat. We're a pretty mellow town. It was actually kind of fun.

    When I called my wife to let her know I would be late. She chewed on me making sure I was properly armed. I always am. But, you have to love a woman than encourages you to make sure you have your rifle handy. Just in case.
    Sean K. and TexasChris like this.
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  7. #16
    XCR Guru Sean K.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomAiello View Post
    It's amazing to me that so many people are ignoring that video (and that incident, really) in their desperate rush to paint this as a racial issue, rather than a police state issue.

    The 'us' and 'them' in this case are not segregated along racial lines. But it's politically convenient for many in power to pretend that they are.

    I think the problem is largely that most of "white conservative" America doesn't believe there's a problem with the police state and most black Americans don't believe that white people are being murdered at higher numbers by police, thereby exemplifying an out of control police state (and part of that is b/c the numbers are intentionally skewed b/c if you view them from percentages of the population....blacks are many times more likely to be killed by police than the raw data would show....but that's also b/c they won't admit that while only 13% of the population, they commit around 50% of the crime according to the FBI's UCR...not that govt. stats are perfect obviously). Plenty of blame to go around.
    RobertSlaughter likes this.
    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human liberty. It is the argument of tyrants; the creed of slaves."-William Pitt the Younger

  8. #17
    XCR Guru TomAiello's Avatar
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    I feel like the correct response to the "Black Lives Matter" slogan is something along the lines of "All Lives Matter."

    Turning a police state problem into race riots is not a solution. Discussing the underlying militarization of the police is going to be a lot more productive. I honestly don't believe that the skin color of the guys in uniform is the deciding factor here. It's their training and mindset. We are training police as if they are soldiers going into a war zone, prioritizing their survival. That's not a police force--it's an occupying army.

    Police should be _part_ of their community. Not an outside force. Police work is _not_ the next step on a career path that begins in the military.

    We could improve the situation immediately by simply demilitarizing the police. Get rid of the assault rifles and bullet proof vests, start training them in conflict resolution instead of force escalation, stop passing down military equipment from the Pentagon.

    There's a fairly good book on the topic here: https://www.amazon.com/Rise-Warrior-.../dp/1610394577

    And a reasonable summary description here: https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/...tter-v11n4.pdf
    - Tom Aiello
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    ...I don't care, I'm still free, you can't take the sky from me...

  9. #18
    XCR Guru Sean K.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomAiello View Post
    I feel like the correct response to the "Black Lives Matter" slogan is something along the lines of "All Lives Matter."

    Turning a police state problem into race riots is not a solution. Discussing the underlying militarization of the police is going to be a lot more productive. I honestly don't believe that the skin color of the guys in uniform is the deciding factor here. It's their training and mindset. We are training police as if they are soldiers going into a war zone, prioritizing their survival. That's not a police force--it's an occupying army.

    Police should be _part_ of their community. Not an outside force. Police work is _not_ the next step on a career path that begins in the military.

    We could improve the situation immediately by simply demilitarizing the police. Get rid of the assault rifles and bullet proof vests, start training them in conflict resolution instead of force escalation, stop passing down military equipment from the Pentagon.

    There's a fairly good book on the topic here: https://www.amazon.com/Rise-Warrior-.../dp/1610394577

    And a reasonable summary description here: https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/...tter-v11n4.pdf
    Don't say that too loud. People are literally losing their shit when someone has the audacity to say that "all lives matter"....even though equality is the ideal we should be striving for.

    We are 100% on the same page though....

    A recent study showed most minorities are shot by minority officers, not white ones....so again, agree that race isn't the problem; mindset/culture is.

    The problem with militarization is that it entices upper management to look at everything as an opportunity to use the "tools" they have at their disposal to overwhelm the enemy...which happens to be the citizens of this country. When all you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail.
    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human liberty. It is the argument of tyrants; the creed of slaves."-William Pitt the Younger

  10. #19
    XCR Guru Sean K.'s Avatar
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    Just a follow up on the study I mentioned:

    https://www.npr.org/2019/07/26/74573...minority-suspe


    And a critique of said study......

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019...ies-draws-fire
    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human liberty. It is the argument of tyrants; the creed of slaves."-William Pitt the Younger

  11. #20
    XCR Guru TomAiello's Avatar
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    Here's an interesting article about a federal level legislator who is actually trying to change things in a constructive manner:

    https://reason.com/2020/06/06/justin...n=fee_partners
    - Tom Aiello
    [email protected]

    ...I don't care, I'm still free, you can't take the sky from me...

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