[Chowwow]

M is more relevant in 308 than the SPEAR is going to be for decades, if ever.

Are you saying that because of Sig's track record of abandoning or obsoleting platforms/generations? Because I honestly think they are going to get the contract, even if they have to evolve the Spear later on down the line. 277 Fury seems like an expensive and complicated round, but it seems to be doing well in the trials as far as I can see.

$8K

I know right? No way I can hide that kind of expense from the missus! I'd rather save for a Barrett M82 or M107 at that rate. I just hope Sig can bring it down to $2K in a couple years or so (probably $3K considering how much the vanilla MCX Virtus is going for these days).

 

[navalbeaver]

Even if the SPEAR wins with the 277 the cost for a civilian shooter are going to outweigh the benefits for most except in bragging rights. 308 isn't going away and will do just about anything you could want fairly well already at a price point that 277 is going to take a long to time to get to, if ever. 308 and the M are available now.

Where are the rifles (416/m27, SCAR etc)that have won military contracts and other specialized military rds(6.8spc, 4.6, 5.7(most successful?)) from the last 20 years? Sig is doing great with the 320/m17/18, but it's really just another Tupperware handgun that met the criteria at a cheap price. An $8k heavy, overly complicated SBR, with suppressor that shoots 80kpsi $2/rd? ammo isn't going to take the civilian market by storm. There's going to be some great Instagram posts and I'm sure RECOIL will have a killer write up about it once released. If I get the chance, I'd absolutely shoot one. But I think the reality is it's a niche system for a small number of government backed shooters who don't care about cost and end up going back to an AR platform when people stop paying attention.

Just a thought.

ETA: I'm in the middle of watching the Navy get a new helicopter trainer. It's not pretty. I may be jaded a bit.

 

[Sean K.]

If the SCAR is any indication, the SPEAR isn't going to be below $4500....ever. Probably not even $5K without the can and optic.

 

[willpgn]

If the SCAR is any indication, the SPEAR isn't going to be below $4500....ever. Probably not even $5K without the can and optic.

With current inflation, $8K might be about right now a days! 🤣🥲🥲😥😥😥

 

[Kraquin]

If the 80k pressure is a cost driver for manufacturing the platform couldn't someone develop a lighter brass cased load? That would enable reloading as well. Course there may be too much of a trade-off in performance.

 

[Chowwow]

If the 80k pressure is a cost driver for manufacturing the platform couldn't someone develop a lighter brass cased load? That would enable reloading as well. Course there may be too much of a trade-off in performance.

From what I understand from the Sig representative, the stainless steel section of the case was added so that the internal walls of the case were a consistent thickness, so they would have as much internal space for powder as possible to reach the pressures they were going for. Very thoughtfully designed.

With that in mind, I still wonder if the -M can adapted to shoot 227 Fury at this rate, or if the gun needs to be upgraded to contain the pressures. The Spear looks a lot beefier than the regular MCX, beyond the wider mag well.

 

[navalbeaver]

Poly cased offering from Beretta/GD/TVC is coming too. It's a barrel change to run the 6.8 offering or, if the poly case catches on, 308 in the poly case.

What about the 277 are you after?

 

[Chowwow]

What about the 277 are you after?

It's nothing really, just trying to say on top of technology; if the military is looking to replace their main battle rifle caliber I want to be in on it. However, time will tell if that really comes to pass or if there are any changes to the availability of 5.56 or .308 when 227 Fury hits.

 

[PhoURiceNTheSushi12]

I love to have the 227 6.8x51. They have 2 of those models of the ammunition, One is like 80 bucks and the other is like 34 bucks. Robinson said if they get enough demand they will make one.

 

[Kraquin]

I imagine the civilian market will react similarly to how it has in the past with regards to what .mil is using and why wouldn't it. It drives platform sales and If the ammo houses are cranking out tens of millions of 227 Fury then as a manufacturer I'd be crunching numbers to see if I can (cost) effectively modify my product to accomodate it. After Army makes their selection it won't surprise me to see some new toys from other than Sig hit your LGS.

 

[Sean K.]

Interesting review if you haven't seen it. Odd that they kept the two charging systems. Dust cover....good idea. RA should consider it.

 

[MickeyC]

.277 gives you about 350fps above .308 velocities And the pressure/concussion is significant.The end state contract is pretty big and the take up adoption is intended to be large scale. Most civilians won’t really benefit from it and it’ll be a decade most likely before anyone sees them in volume at the civilian level. Note too that the hybrid cases can’t be reloaded so the cost of full power .277 will be high. Most likely folks will buy the Spear with .277 and .308 conversions.

 

[Sean K.]

.277 gives you about 350fps above .308 velocities And the pressure/concussion is significant.The end state contract is pretty big and the take up adoption is intended to be large scale. Most civilians won’t really benefit from it and it’ll be a decade most likely before anyone sees them in volume at the civilian level. Note too that the hybrid cases can’t be reloaded so the cost of full power .277 will be high. Most likely folks will buy the Spear with .277 and .308 conversions.

Agree 100%

 

[Flskunkape]

Watched a video the other day with a sig rep, I think it was tfbtv but not positive. From the sig reps mouth, he said they could boost average cartridge velocity by that 300-350 fps on any existing cartridge by using the advanced 2 part casings they developed. Could seriously change the "pisto-la" game.

 

[navalbeaver]

Because of the increased pressure the case will handle..... that'll bring increased wear/tear on the gun.

I haven't looked real hard but I haven't heard a barrel life expectancy with 80k psi. Also haven't heard anything about inherent accuracy of the .277.

 

[Flskunkape]

Because of the increased pressure the case will handle..... that'll bring increased wear/tear on the gun.

I haven't looked real hard but I haven't heard a barrel life expectancy with 80k psi. Also haven't heard anything about inherent accuracy of the .277.

All valid points,but I think if one can afford to burn out a barrel with that expensive of a round they could get a spare barrel to run it through. Or just to have on hand for when accuracy goes kaput.

However I do agree with you on the parts life expectancy, that's why I'm not into Creedmoor. I think it's cost prohibitive for the minimal gains over a 308.

 

[Sean K.]

Because of the increased pressure the case will handle..... that'll bring increased wear/tear on the gun.

I haven't looked real hard but I haven't heard a barrel life expectancy with 80k psi. Also haven't heard anything about inherent accuracy of the .277.

That GT video says 10K life IIRC.

 

[TTEngineer]

Furry rounds are what $1.50/rd?

That’s $15,000 in ammo before you need a new barrel. Excuse me while I pick my jaw up off the floor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[navalbeaver]

Don't forget the $8k to get into the SPEAR game