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Gunner69, Others,

I have read about the Kramer 6.8x45 and have followed some threads here on the 6x45.

If we were able to get the numbers together for a Group Custom barrel project for a XCR barrel only conversation - what should we go with? I'm sure there will only be one that could be supported.

Exclaimer - I am not a Current XCR owner but I was holding out for the new Stock/trigger/color coat - but I may need to buy sooner while I still can :(

Any thoughts would be great!
Thanks

6.8x45mm Kramer Urban Combat Cartridge
http://www.defensereview.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1143
 

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I would love to see the 6.8x45. But would settle for the 6x45 or the 6.5x45.
 

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toth, I own two 6x45s, an AR-15 and my Robinson M-96. Both shoot great groups and are capable of taking whitetails and below. I can't talk for or against the 6.8 or 6.5x45. I would suspect the 6.8 (.277cal) is a bit big for the case. The 6.5x45 would be for short range, my opinion, due to the lack of case capicity. :2cents:

I think RobArms would have a winner with the 6x45 though. A CHEAP conversion kit (no bolt or extras needed) for a caliber that would be legal for deer. Plus it's an accurate round as it used to be used by bench rest shooters. Plus the brass is cheap!!! :2cents: :duh:
 

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Gunner I agree that the 6.8 would be too large for the case,however the 6.5 with the lighter bullets and some of Hornady's proprietary powder they use in some of their hot stuff,might just be the ticket.I would settle for the 6mm,but I would love to see loads worked up for both and comparison done as to velocities,etc.I have a feeling the 6.5 won't lose much to the 6mm ballistically,due to the higher b.c.'s of the longer bullet.If a manufacturer would pick up this in a commercial load(either 6mm or 6.5mm)I bet it would be a hit.Hell while we're at it why not try a 25. cal bullet,that might be a best balance of them all,in that case.



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I think the 6.5 would be the way to go for me. I would probably try the 6.5 if they offered it.
 

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My preference would be for the 6x45 for the extra velocity, less pressure means longer case/barrel life. Getting too much larger in caliber would mean extra case neck stretching/splitting/work hardening on the sizing step, that 6.8x45 would be the major concern here. The 6.5 maybe not as bad.

The name "6.8 Urban" cartridge I think sums up its capabilities. Close-in. Every cartridge choice is a balance in performance though.

Like Gunner, I can't speak for the other cartridges, they're new and fairly propietary yet. The 6x45 is established with a good record of performance. There is also a large selection of bullets for 6mm across the spectrum from varmint to heavy hunting slugs to match grade. Sierra and Hornady even make FMJ's. With the right barrel twist (faster than 1:10) it could be a very effective slug for any number of uses.

I don't know what their requirements would be for a special edition group buy but I imagine well more than a dozen. It sounds like they're shifting focus to the XCR-M as well so it might not be a welcome question...but the answer is always NO if you don't ask! I'd be down on the 6x45 first, but out of respect for DTOM I suppose I could live with the 6.5 if it were offered. ;)
 

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I think the idea of a cartridge of this type is underappreciated.It might not be a super long range burner like some others.What it does do however,is offer increased power,penetration.Stopping power,And a deer legal caliber in a package that allows you to just change the barrel and go.In my opinion that's pretty damn sweet.I will get on board with whichever one has the greatest likelyhood of being picked up by a major ammo manufacturer.I don't reload yet,so that's very important to me.
I should be clear that I don't think the 6mm is a bad choice,it's just not my favorite caliber choice of the ones currently under consideration.I don't suppose it exists,hell idk maybe someone has wildcatted it before,but a 25 caliber version of the 45 mm parent.and not trying to be repetitive,but might be the best balance.Whats say a 25. cal. 100 grainer going 2650,dose that sound about right?



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I have been anxiously awaiting the release of the 6.5x39 but am intrigued with the idea of the compatability a cartridge like the 6x45 might offer. Would it require special magazines? I took a look at my pmags and it does not look like a larger caliber bullet would be compatible. Perhaps standard GI mags would not pose an problem. Count me in if it is as easy as a barrel swap.
 

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Reading some of the literature on the 6.8x45 he had trouble with the PMags but I took a look at some dummy rounds (6x45) I loaded up and they fit perfectly and stripped without any additional effort as compared to a 5.56 round.

I reload so I look at it from a different point of view. There are a lot of 6mm bullets to choose from. As the other calibers are traditionally for larger cases (6.8 is the same as .270, etc) they are usually heavier slugs and would not be too good to load for in this instance unless you were going for a subsonic load. :2cents:
 

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The 85gr Nosler Partition, I use in my 6x45, seems to do wonders on Whitetails & Coyotes. ;D And they have worked in EVERY standard 5.56 magazine I have tried without mods. ;D
 

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If we're really serious we need to get a consensus going on what would be the "group order" and a good count of interested parties prior to contacting Robinson. My inputs in blue...

First of all, a choice of caliber 6x45

Twist 1:8

Material stainless barrel, the reamers to chrome line it would be cost prohibitive I think but the stainless would give some of the benefits. Bead blasted, coated, threaded 5/8x24, lightweight profile

Length standard 16" works for me
 

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Everything you said m118sb would work for me too.I completely agreed on the stainless.I think chrome is overrated for all but jungle combat conditions,but that's a debate for another time.Ijust hope an ammo manufacturer picks up the cartridge.Again I would prefere the 6.5x45,but if the 6mm wins the popularity contest I have no problem with that either.



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