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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Got something too good to pass up.

Want to join the excitement? While I won't claim credit, Fred did make a comment in this article I've been saying for quite a while - hearing the story, our history, the telling of our heritage, is worth the trip in itself.

So who's with me? Trust me on this one, the XCR isn't only 'good enough' for this, it can dominate. Trust me.

The following is reprinted with the expressed permission of the author:

[Here, hot off the press, is the "Appleseed" portion of Fred's column the upcoming March 1 issue of SGN]

It’s really kinda exciting! (And those of you regular readers of this column know Fred’s not too excitable.)
Or as my buddy would say “it’s outta sight!” But then, he’s an old guy, like Fred, and therefore talks funny...
However, a shooting event that’s coast-to-coast?
When was the last time you ever heard of such a thing?
Answer: Never!
RWVA has a way of coming up with stuff that’s never happened before. As in, never in the history of the country!
Stuff that’s high energy.
That’s ground-breaking, even.
Take the Appleseed program itself, for example.
Has anyone ever tried mass training of Americans, using other volunteer Americans, with no help from a government agency or anyone else?
“Mass” in connection with a few thousand may seem a misnomer, compared to all the millions of gun owners out there.
But for most people, when you get over a thousand trained in the first year of a program, that’s mass!
And when you have the gall to set the program’s goals to double every year, you’re not only showing spunk, but soon you’re really gonna be into mass training.
This year, the goal is 4000. How many shooting/marksmanship programs can boast of that - particularly after only two years ‘in business’?
And if you can find one that can match that, hang around for another year, ‘cause we’re gonna do our best to double again - to 8000 a year in ‘09.
Match that? Hang around another year, cause we plan to double again - to 16,000! (No, we’re not nuts. We want to make progress and have an impact in our lifetimes, so we plan each year to double in size, for as long as possible.)
Should I mention that the program sets a standard of teaching marksmanship skills that enables the average shooter, with a rack-grade rifle and surplus ammo, to hit a man-sized target at 500 yards?
That’s a high standard, indeed.
Takes a shooter who shows up all too often not being able to hit said target at 100 yards, and tries mightily to make him a “300-yard shooter”, in one weekend? (Do the math, and you’ll find a 300-yard shooter is NINE times as good a shot as a 100-yard shooter - & some shooters do better than that in an Appleseed weekend.) And sends him home with the admonition - and the goal and motivation - to persist until he can do 500 yards (that’s 25 times as good as a 100-yd shooter).
A program that travels the country, that can put up a range on vacant land for a weekend, then Sunday evening fold it up and take it back, until the next weekend, a thousand miles away?
A program that requires only 25m to train people to skills that will work at 500 yards?
Did I say, a program started by everyday ordinary Americans, staffed by everyday, ordinary Americans, and run by everyday, ordinary Americans?
Say, that’s a pretty remarkable program, wouldn’t you say? Cost the taxpayers nothing. All volunteers...
And you notice that so far I’ve said nothing about introducing Americans to a proud heritage that’s second to none on the planet, even if those in the program, including the students, love and enjoy that part most of all.
Yep, the Story of April 19th, 1775.
If you haven’t heard it, you need to go to an Appleseed, just to hear it! Just to hear The Story.
It’s a story that’ll make you proud of your heritage. It’ll make you feel every American should know the story, that if they did, this would be a different country - and a far better one.
It’s a story that’ll surprise you, cause you think you know it - and you don’t.
Think the Revolution started at Lexington and/or Concord? It didn’t, and if you said either, you’re wrong, not once, but twice over.
Know who fired “the first shot”? No, and neither do historians, generations of whom have speculated about it.
It took riflemen to puzzle out the answer to that question, and we’ll be glad to tell you, at an Appleseed, who fired first.
It’s a story that will affect you in some unexpected ways, and you may find even you - big, tough, burly, manly you - tearing up at certain moments (just don’t let anyone else see - but then why are they looking away from everyone else? )
Now, check the calendar for April this year and what do you find?
That April 19th falls on a Saturday.
And what does the Appleseed program do? It teaches marksmanship and the story of April 19th - on Saturdays. Any way we could let April 19th slip past this year without doing something special?
I think not. Not if we pretend to be Americans.
Particularly since we live with the burden John Adams placed on us: that if we ever forget what they did, what the founders did, they’ll be sorry they ever did it.
No way we want John Adams to be sorry for one of the greatest achievements in world history: seizing, on the battlefield, the cup of Liberty.
A bunch of rag-tag colonists, boot-strapping their way to liberty, something that all the European snots have never been able to do.
Sorta like the Appleseed program, you could say. Volunteer Americans, teaching other volunteer Americans how to shoot, and dipping them in the heritage, for good measure. Despite brickbats from the do-nothing know-it-alls, the jeers from fellow gunowners, the gibes from the jealous, salvos from yer standard keyboard kommandoes - it’s all water off a duck’s back.
Appleseed simply shakes it all off, and plugs away, continuing with the Mission.
So this April 19th weekend, we’ll be hosting Appleseeds from coast-to-coast across this great land.
From California to Florida to North Carolina, from Texas to Illinois - and Iowa - and even up in free (smile) Massachusetts, just a few miles from Lexington and Concord!
All on the same weekend.
When was the last time something like this was done?
A continent-wide shooting event, “from sea to shining sea...”
A nation-wide commemoration of the events of April 19, 1775.
Telling The Story to Americans who need to hear it.
An instance of honoring, by remembering - from coast to coast...
Will the names of the eight dead at Lexington Green be read? You bet!
Will the name Isaac Davis be spoken in hushed reverence? You bet!
Will we hear about William Heath, Jason Russell, Sam Whitamore, Amni Cutter, and the young drummer boy, William Diamond?
You bet!
Will Americans across this great land be immersed in a tradition that they’ve forgotten, only to find they’re glad they’ve been immersed? You bet!
I hope we’ll have to turn people away. That there are so many people eager to become part of their heritage that we’ll be swamped.
But this is life, not dreams, so I expect we’ll have plenty of room at most Appleseeds that day.
Even if some of the locations that weekend have limited capacity, so pre-registration is urged. In fact, in case there’s a big turnout, I suggest you pre-reg for the one you want to attend, just to make sure of your spot on the line.
And pre-reg your neighbors, friends, co-workers, and family and relatives, too. It’s a great bonding experience, shares the cost of gas, gives you people to talk about your experiences at Appleseed on that long drive home, and helps the Cause, too. Is that win-win-win-win-win?
Take part in something that hasn’t been done since the beginning of our country.
Something much larger than you. Something good. Something you can be a part of. Something you want to be part of.
Coast-to-coast, nation-wide simultaneous shooting events that foster marksmanship and the American tradition, ensuring each will be passed on.
You talk about it. You agree with it.
Now, show your support, by coming to it.
It’s easy to pre-reg: By mail, to RWVA, POB 756, Ramseur, NC 27316. On the internet, at http://www.rwva.org.
Hang the expense! This is about your country! Your life! Your family! Your kids! Your future!
I expect a minimum of 500 to show up. Isn’t that pathetic, in a land of 80 million fearless, dedicated gun owners? We prob have room for a thousand, max (and that’s a pathetic figure - why Texas alone should be ashamed if that few turned out).
Here’s a list of the ten events nailed down to date, with two others still ‘in the pipeline’. Look on it as a roll call of honor:


Piru, California Ramseur, North Carolina Harvard, Massachusetts Ottawa, Illinois
Searsboro, Iowa Pensacola, Florida Lexington, Kentucky
Freedom, Indiana Canon City, Colorado Davilla, Texas

If hard luck, illness, work or other ill fortune - or the warmth and comfort of the couch - prevents you from coming, fear not. There will be a second chance next year, when April 19th falls on a Sunday, and we hope to have, not 12, but TWO DOZEN (and talk of FIFTY) ground-breaking, tradition-making Appleseeds across the country.
Who knows, we keep going with this, maybe we’ll make some progress.
I hope you hope so, because if you don’t hope so, this country is in for some real bad stuff. And the problem starts, as it generally does, with you.
Yes, you are the problem. Lazy, hapless, hopeless, helpless you.
But you are also the solution, when you decide you no longer want to be without hope, without help. When you decide that you want to become like the men of the Revolutionary War, men respected by their enemies, men of worth, who ‘know what they are about’.
April 19th will be here before you know it. If you have any interest in partaking in this nation-wide project, on one magic weekend, I’d sign up now, and start to work on friends, neighbors, co-workers, family and relatives.
Project April 19, 1775 is a celebration - maybe even a party - and you want to bring as many as you can with you, so they can enjoy and participate.
Member of a gun club? See if you can fill a vehicle with fellow members and show up, ready to learn to shoot - and to check out the Appleseed program - it could mean a mighty boost to your club, were your club to host an Appleseed, back home.
It’s been said of the program, that Appleseed is “purpose-driven riflery.”
It could also be said Appleseed is "Common folks teaching other common folks to shoot uncommonly well".
So, let it be said...
 

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Damn Bravo, Bet your fingers are numb after writting that one :2cents: I've been tracking that program in the Shotgun News. ;D
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Actually, the only part I wrote was the beginning.... up until the [hot off the press] part.

I asked Fred if I could post this on a few other forums, and he gave me the green-light. The rest is cut-and-paste from what you'll see in SGN.

Even so, the program is a great one. I could, and have, gone on and on about it.

A new development: One of the places an Appleseed is set up is one of my AlmaMaters: BadLands Tactical. The Appleseed program is starting a third day (currently, there's a 2-day program, typically a weekend, and a 7 day program) exercise. Two days as a regular Appleseed, then a third day on the long-range course. Nothing but long-range, hitting hard, and getting energy on target.

BadLands (or as some of us call it, BobbyWorld) is all about the mantra "know your rifle, know your ammo, know yourself". The cadre there is ALL about people learning to hit. BadLands and Appleseed, a match made in heaven!

In all honesty, I'm kind of jealous - I'd love to take part in that one! Neither the basic nor advanced sniper courses did much with unsupported positions (TONS of field positions, but not much unsupported!) and I love doing that stuff. Hitting steel with battle rifles and funhouses - I'll take that over Disney ANY day.

If anyone CAN make it to BadLands, and doesn't, they literally have no concept of what they're missing.
 

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Are you kidding me??? I grew up in Lawton OK...elementry, through BA in college. Never heard of this place. I would have gone there in a heartbeat. Guess I am going to have to plan a trip to visit friends...

I will have to look more into this appleseed thing.


Bravo, we need to talk offline about this appleseed thing. If I am not deployed I may try to attend one close to me. I would like to talk to you first though and get some info.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Dudeski, I am - quite literally - at your disposal.

BobbyWorld hasn't been in operation 'that long'. Long enough to earn and receive consistent rave reviews from people I know though. People that know a difference. Heck, my partner has his own accomodations there (GRIN) as he's good for just about anything. When I went out there, I didn't know who Steve Suttles was specifically (just a general understanding) - that man has my respect in spades!

One of the other things that is so incredibly impressive is that they're willing to accomodate specific requests. That's possible because they typically limit the class sizes to between 5 and 10 students. So it really is a matter of "Hey Bobby, I've got 4 friends who are 100%. We want to take a course in blah, blah, and blah". Normally, no problem. The class I've signed up for this coming summer is exactly like that...... not even listed.

Anything I can do to help you, just say the word.

But growing up in Lawton (GRIN)? I'd bet you know at least a couple of the same folks I do then LOL! Sad thing is, since '94 I've lived in the desert. Either White Sands Missile Range, or where I am now. A trip into Lawton in the summer, during the rainy season, means 95+ degrees and swamp-like humidity. I think it's the humidity that kicks my butt, 'cause we get plenty warm here in the summer. Trying to sleep when a tornado touches down on the outskirts of town wasn't cake either.

Oh yeah, and then there's my favorite pets - chiggers. Missed applying dope one day, came back looking like I had a skin disease.

I hate the area so much I did (and still am) considering purchasing land there for retirement.

Just let me know what I can help with. I believe in the Appleseed program so much that I've set aside time to attend 4 this year (Up two from last year. My boy - the kiddo who got his picture in SWAT magazine this month - is gonna hit Marksman before he's 12 if I buy him some mags, I just know it!) at a total of about 1200 miles or so. I'm hosting one as close to me as I can work it, and have a goal next year of hosting the same one AND another one on 18 and 19 April.

Appleseed and BadLands - a match made in heaven. Specifically, Rifleman's heaven.
 

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After reading more about the Appleseed shoots I think I will give it a shot. Do I understand correctly that Active Duty Military shoot free? Would me XCR be an appropriate weapon or should I try to get the M1A from my mom since she never shoots it?

I hated Lawton growing up there but looking back it was great. I went from Dove to Archery Deer, Elk, Gun Elk/deer and quail all in the span of a few months. The hunting on Ft. Sill was outstanding and then only let military hunt there (unlike other military instalations I have been to).

I think I know one of the instructors there, Sam Feeback. If i dig around a bit I could find a receipt where my mom sold him a Sig .45 back in the late 80's.

I am more than confident that we know at least a few of the same people.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Appleseeds are indeed free to any active in the military. As well, they're also free to anyone 20 and under. For me, I pay the fee, my son shoots free - how can you ask for better than that?

I took the XCR to one a while back, prior to that (I've been to three total to date) I ran my M14 exclusively. The '14 is of course a battle rifle, whereas the XCR is a carbine...... and I'm eagerly awaiting the day I can run an XCR in 7.62 NATO at an Appleseed. My XCR, with forward mounted Aimpoint M3 (2 MOA dot) allowed me to shoot high into the expert category - stock trigger.

Here's the deal..... they run the reduced targets at 25 meters for the first day all the time. That allows folks with 22LR sticks to be every bit as 'into it' as the folks running 7.62 NATO sticks. The first time I saw the reduced targets, I was on our range at WSMR when the National Guardsmen came out to qualify. Anyway, the other idea is that you can screw up at 25 meters as easy as you can at 400 yards - it's just easier and quicker to walk to the targets. Remember, the Appleseed is designed to produce Riflemen, it's not a competition! They don't care what your level of experience is, everyone learns something - from 'new shooter' kids to 'new shooter' older guys to a tripple distinguished NRA highpower shooter. Depending on the range and the make-up (numbers and skill) of the attendees, the second day sometimes is done at the real ranges (or some reduced, if the range doesn't go all the way out). Obviously if 95% of the attendees can't shoot expert and there's only 15 there on the 2nd day, you're gonna do another day of 25 meter targets. But trust me, they're deceptively difficult ;-) If it were me, I'd just expect to run the 25 meter targets both days - anything else would be a treat.

On hunting on post, sometimes it can be done well. At WSMR, they had one MP acting as game warden per hunter that drew for the oryx hunt. I thought that was interesting. Both the hunter and the MP would belly-crawl within distance easy shot...... I bet that was an adventure LOL!

Let me know if I can help!
 

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I really want to do one of these at some point. Any in PA/OH/WV?

Also, do you have the targets they use? If so, you could put em in the tacked targets thread so we can practice ;D
 

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Way cool. The VA shoot is about 160 miles away from me. Gonna have to check it out. Thanks!
 

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I was browsing through old topics and noticed this. After reading up on it, it sounds absolutely like something I would want to do. I'm getting my XCR in 5.56 within the next week or so, and I'd love to go out for one of these. Active mil shoot free? Sweet. I'll take any advice from anyone who has been through this program.
 

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Hmmm, sounds interesting. I think I'd like to take a .22 LR to this. The closest one to me says its a 100 - 200 yard range so that would be about right for the mouse shooter!

Maybe take both the XCR and the .22 :)
 
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