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Seems like more and states are getting sick of the Fed's BS...

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=67229

Oklahoma to feds: Don't tread on me
State House defends its sovereignty from D.C. intrusion

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Posted: June 16, 2008
10:00 pm Eastern

© 2008 WorldNetDaily

Steamed over a perceived increase in federal usurping of states' rights, Oklahoma's House of Representatives told Washington, D.C., to back off.

Joint House Resolution 1089, passed by an overwhelming 92-3 margin, reasserts Oklahoma's sovereignty under the Tenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, and, according to the resolution's own language, is "serving notice to the federal government to cease and desist certain mandates."

The Tenth Amendment states, "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."

Traditionally, this language has meant that the federal government is limited in its scope and cannot usurp the sovereign powers of states. In recent decades, however, as the size and reach of the federal government has expanded, many have come to question whether Washington has stepped on states' rights and gotten too big for its breeches.

Charles Key, the Republican state representative who authored the resolution, told WND that he introduced it because he believes the federal government's overstepping of its bounds has put our constitutional form of government in danger.


Oklahoma State Rep. Charles Key

"The more we stand by and watch the federal government get involved in areas where it has no legal authority, we kill the Constitution a little at a time," he said. "The last few decades, the Constitution has been hanging by a thread."

Specifically, Resolution 1089 says the following:

"The State of Oklahoma hereby claims sovereignty under the Tenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States over all powers not otherwise enumerated and granted to the federal government by the Constitution of the United States."

The resolution resolves that Oklahoma will "serve as notice and demand to the federal government, as our agent, to cease and desist, effective immediately, mandates that are beyond the scope of these constitutionally delegated powers."

It also instructs that "a copy of this resolution be distributed to the president of the United States, the president of the United States Senate, the speaker of the United States House of Representatives, the speaker of the House and the president of the Senate of each state's legislature of the United States of America, and each member of the Oklahoma congressional delegation."

The resolution does not, as some have speculated, amount to secession, but it does send a warning signal to Washington: Oklahoma does not intend to be bullied by big brother government.

The Sooner State became a hotbed of federal vs. state authority clashes earlier this month when a federal judge blocked a portion of Oklahoma's tough immigration laws, ruling that plaintiffs would likely establish that the state mandates preempted federal immigration laws.

Oklahoma's immigration statute, known as the Oklahoma Taxpayer and Citizen Protection Act of 2007, originated as House Bill 1804 (co-authored, incidentally, by Key). It has been characterized by USA Today as "arguably the nation's toughest state law targeting illegal immigration."

The statute prohibits illegal immigrants from receiving tax-supported services and makes it a state crime to transport or harbor illegal immigrants. It also mandates that businesses take measures to verify the work eligibility of employees and independent contractors.

The U.S. Chamber of Commerce and individual chambers of commerce in Oklahoma challenged the latter mandates, set to go into effect July 1, in court.

On June 4th, U.S. District Judge Robin J. Cauthron issued an injunction against enforcing the July 1 mandates.

"We've just had a federal judge say that our immigration law's employer provisions are unconstitutional, claiming it as federal government territory," said Key in response. "That goes right to the issue of (Resolution 1089). The federal government doesn't have the right to have sole domain over that issue or many of the issues it has spilled over into."

Though House Joint Resolution 1089 received great support in Oklahoma's House of Representatives, it has now hit a roadblock. In the state's Senate, where the seats are split, 24-24, between Republicans and Democrats, the resolution was sent to the Senate's rules committee, where it languished without action until the legislature adjourned.

According to Key, the Senate has worked out agreements on how to manage the political tie, including power given to the Democratic senators to not hear certain bills. Those senators, says Key, refuse to even hear Resolution 1089.

In the House, where Republicans enjoy a 57-44 majority, Resolution 1089 received a hearing and was supported overwhelmingly on both sides of the aisle.

"I was on the Democratic side of the floor," said Key, "and one member went off talking about how far we've gotten, how bad (federal overreaches of power) are getting – it's the kind of thing you hear in coffee shops."

Key said his bill "is making a difference" in the way legislators in Oklahoma are talking and thinking about state's rights. "I think it will make even more of a difference," he said, "when I bring it up again." He vows to put the pressure on Oklahoma's Senate to pass a resolution like 1089, and he plans to begin communicating the cause with legislators around the country, urging them to bring up the issue in their states.

Key passed a similar resolution in 1994, when he was serving a previous tenure in the legislature. But that attempt was only a House resolution. He authored 1089 as a joint resolution because, he said, he wanted to increase its exposure. "As people who believe in this constitutional form of government," he said, "we need to bring this issue to a national level and debate."
 

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I hated growing up in Oklahoma but looking back it was nothing but good times. We need more states that are willing to tell the Government to mind their own buisness and stay out of the states buisness.
 
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Having only skimmed that article I will comment on Montana's issue here as it pertains and appears to be the same.

The seccession question was effectively solved during the civil war when the question whether a state could secede or not was answered with a resounding NO.

What we are looking at here with the last few states to enter the union like OK, MT, AK etc. is a breach of contract issue. the breaches by the fed could be interpreted as nullifying the contract for statehood and thus make the effected entities a sovereign state again and not subject to the federal authority.

at least thats the way our Governor explained it.
 

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A state that might leave the union isn't guaranteed to have a gov't any less corrupt than the feds.
 

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The word is all over the short waves ,and political forums the House met behind closed doors last night for only the 5th time in our History.
That is a fact ,what is frightening the Dept.of Homeland security was there and leaks are saying they were asked if they could crush any rebellions in America resulting from what is supposed to be happening in September.
Today the House Republicans drafted the most extensive gun control bill in our history ,showing us they are all Commies up there.
The joint chiefs were asked if they understood the use and implication of Martial Law if it were declared.
Either way guys something is coming down soon ,and gas prices are only the first round with the Saudis saying there is no reason for oil to be no higher than $70.00 a barrel and they are sick of getting the blame.
And they are pissed because Bush in a photo op meeting with them on what to do when it is our Government asking them not to boost production.
Simple ,High gas ,high taxes on it and it limits you movement.
Look around ,everyone is saying this today.
 
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The word is all over the short waves ,and political forums the House met behind closed doors last night for only the 5th time in our History.
That is a fact ,what is frightening the Dept.of Homeland security was there and leaks are saying they were asked if they could crush any rebellions in America resulting from what is supposed to be happening in September.
Today the House Republicans drafted the most extensive gun control bill in our history ,showing us they are all Commies up there.
The joint chiefs were asked if they understood the use and implication of Martial Law if it were declared.
Either way guys something is coming down soon ,and gas prices are only the first round with the Saudis saying there is no reason for oil to be no higher than .00 a barrel and they are sick of getting the blame.
And they are pissed because Bush in a photo op meeting with them on what to do when it is our Government asking them not to boost production.
Simple ,High gas ,high taxes on it and it limits you movement.
Look around ,everyone is saying this today.

umm...ok

I see the house had a secret session in march, but no mention of one last night.

What exactly is supposed to happen in september again?

please provide some sort of documentation for these assertions.
 

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They passed the War money Bush wanted ,i am sure it came with strings.
That is Documented ,the other is ,Buy a Short Wave and Listen.
 

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What did Al Gore say? "No controlling legal authority" or some corrupt BS
like that.
Pretty soon some state is going to grow some testicles or ovaries or whatever
it takes to shut up DC.
DC can't just roll the Marines into Oklahoma or Montana or Alaska.
Why doesn't the Governor of Alaska open up the oil fields in ANWAR or Montana start
coal to gas refining and tell DC to bugger off. What's DC going to do? Have the park rangers
hold off the the drilling. The states control the National Guard. What's DC going to do?
Send in some guys in nice suites and SUV's and use foul language?

"The awakening has begun!"
It's a great time to be alive.
 

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Oil ? i will just put it like this ,think what you want ,flame me i don't care i am upper white collar Oil field and i see the reports.
I know where it is going and i could get fired talking about it.
Remember when we went into Iraq all the talk about getting all that oil ? now you hear nothing about it ? do you really think we are spending Billions over there to protect a bunch of back woods people from insurgents ?the oil is running at high production ,by us.
Because we are good guys ? and all these fingers pointing here and there ,now its the speculators ,BS ,speculators have been around forever why all of a sudden did they grow a brain and all of them do this at once ? and if its that good a deal how come the Clinton's are not into it also ? Before that it was the Saudis ,before that the Oil Company's.
I know why it is like this and you can argue all you want but you are not at my desk everyday ,and you are being told a simple reason to a very complex problem this country got itself into and is trying to get out of.
And you run around looking at everything ,and in doing that you are looking some place they want you to because then you are not looking where they do not want you to look.
People in my position in other districts who told to much ,have been forced into retirement ,or supposedly were let go because they had a dirty drug test . In other words STFU ,is what we are told.
Buy a good Short Wave ,listen to what is said over seas , and ask yourself seriously ,who really would benefit from gas as high as it is ,speculators ? man thats a lot of speculators , saying it is them is like me saying a swarm of mosquito's flew off with my truck.
And why is a certain country allowed to drill in waters we wont let our own company's drill in .
The Saudis ? they just say ,PLLEESSE.
Oil Company's thats it .thats like saying i am getting payed $5.00 for every beer i drink.
You may think i come up with strange stuff ,i have Friends on some forums i have known for years who have come to see me ,after seeing some stuff they don't doubt me one bit.
Who i work for is BIG ,it has its own communication network , and trys to keep a lot of things in house.
All i am asking is try to keep an open mind ,just because what someone say sounds far fetched ,doesn't mean it is ,it may be all they can really say.
I explained the oil problem in a round about way some place else making it comical ,the ones who normally would be saying i was way off base ,or do i have proof ,wrote back reading between the lines telling me that is the most logical argument for this they had ever heard ,why ? because i showed why it is a lot bigger picture than we are told it is.
And i filled in all the gaps they had been trying to fill in ,and it all fit.
So if i act comical and silly ,maybe i do that for a reason.
 
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I explained the oil problem in a round about way some place else making it comical ,the ones who normally would be saying i was way off base ,or do i have proof ,wrote back reading between the lines telling me that is the most logical argument for this they had ever heard

link me.

Look, I'm not flaming you too hard, All I'm asking for is some sort of corroborating evidence. I am well aware of our situation and why oil is where it is and is going where it's going. the states are going to have to buck up and take some initiative, but even if we started drilling every known asset we'd still be looking at 2 more years of increases at the minimum!!

I have seen the path being laid to a joint currency for quite some time. It's pretty obvious if you look at what they are doing and how they did europe. they will crash our currency then provide us with a magic ticket out.

I havent heard this september crash theory until you brought it up. someone should be able to articulate some specific knowledge or reasons why september, if they want me to give it any credibility tho. there are plenty of valid and provable facts out there that point to disaster, but this september crash theory does not seem to benefit from any of them as far a I can see.
 

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It wasn't last night it was on the 16th ,Monday ,and from i have heard from a lady that is a Page ,and her co-worker they say the same.
Another fellow who doesn't even know me posted something about it on another site also.
It was all about the Money Bush wanted for the War which i thought they had already approved ,was the entire house there ? i don't know ,was it a special session ? likewise ,but i know HLS was there ,along with two members of the joint chiefs.
It could have been about Iran ,or what some believe an Economic collapse which isn't rocket science.
And i didn't expect you to believe a damn thing ,and i don't care either way.
But you may certainly inform me about how you know it didn't happen ,or isn't going to.
And i don't know you anymore than you know me , and was i there ?NO ,do i have some foolish desire to act like your mall ninja ?
Not Really do you? But i do know the People who are saying this never gave me reason to think of them as nothing more than who they say they are ,and are usually right if they come out and say something ,or it is the way they see it even if they are wrong.
Also many times i have had Military Friends of mine or my family say they are being re-deployed , There was no link to it ,or news reports until what they told their family's they thought was the reason came out in the news.
I should wonder why you sir believe all you read on the Web or some link .
When Reagan sent those F111 bombers to hit Libya , i heard it on Short Wave from Radio Moscow 6 hours before we heard it on our news. No Internet then ,but if there had been and i posted that you would want a link ,does that mean it didn't happen ?
Instead of ,I'm just flaming a little ,thinking you are one funny dude ,i might PM you something ,or discuss what you think and together we may come up with something .
I explained all of this on another site ,no links ,a few scanned documents ,i seemed to get some numbers right and that shocked some who knew that part . And some coding i do in my office that has been the same for 20 years, changing this time last year ,and some new ones that if you trace them go no where.
Fields and reserves that had always been Mapped for the estimated Barrels per day in production ,now being assessed as to their value, like getting an appraisal on a house .
Its never been done that way ,in the ground meant nothing until it was in the Barrel.
And what i do see is a hell of a lot bigger than any group ,or corporation is able to do .
And you are a smart dude , The people suffering from this ,Economy's ,Entire Country's like ours about to go into full blown Depression . And it is the same in Europe also ,if it were a bunch of people doing this or even a Country ,The US and those country's hurting would arrest them and parade them in front of cameras and hang them like Nazis ,or blockade them and see how they like it.
This isn't just a bunch of folks making money ,nor some country trying to hurt the Dollar ,on this scale this is an act of Economic war ,and if our Government wanted to stop it they would have .
Why September ? because this happened to fast ,and was to strong ,and that is when a lot of Company's say they will not be able to hold out any longer with the losses they have.
And our Government had to know something with it being this fast , it wasn't a fluke ,it had never happened before with oil ,not like this ,someone had to see it coming . Something as big as this is like using a Nuke ,unless they didn't care ,or wanted it to for some reason.
Now ,good day sir ,it was a pleasure and i am sure you have a real good bead on things ,that is if you see it in a link.
Not speculators ,but this isn't entirely true either , The Saudis offered to do this in January ,but one of their biggest customers asked them to hold off.
And where is all the oil we were supposed to be getting from Iraq ? i see it on my reports ,India produces 70& of its own oil ,China 40%.
After people busted the speculator myth that i have said from its start ,we are back to the Saudis ,when the Prince met on an Italian news program with charts showing they had increased production in April 30% and he said they were sick of being blamed for this and to find out why this is happening to look closer to home.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,369926,00.html
Look at the time date on this story Mr.Link ,i posted this before this story aired.
 

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Anyone interested ,i didn't know that the speculator story would fall today ,but i knew it couldn't last ,and wasn't true when people were saying i didn't know what i was talking about.
The boost in production in April was bought up by one customer ,never hitting the Market so it didn't show up.
I have a good idea where it is going to go next , I will know more on that Monday after i get to work.
And after our biggest customer tells us what they want us to do ,so for now it is a shortage ::)
I don't see gas lines ,or stations with ,NO GAS ,signs ,I do see tank battery's full to the brim sitting ,doing nothing.
There is no shortage ,the Arab is right ,no reason for this at all unless you are hording ,in under ground reserves any excess.
And perhaps you don't want people to know that ,or why you feel you need to.
I don't want to sound smug ,i would like some intelligent conversation , or the next time i will come on here again ,and the next day this will happen after i am told i don't have a link.
 

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It is scarcity economics.

Speculators are buying oil futures and selling a month or two later at a profit.
Oil companies, including US companies like Exxon, are not doing anything to increase production. why should they pump more to sell it for less? Lets say you run a business, why would yo uinvest billions ion infrastructure only to see your per unit price drop?

If people believe there is a shortage then prices will go up as demand appears to outstrip supply. Threatending IRAN with military action, Iran threatending Israel with strikes all causes concern over Arabian gulf oil supplies. The invasion of Iraq started this ball rolling. Iran and Iraq combined have more reserves than Saudi Arabia! Add in US producers not increasing their production capacities, in fact showing a 2.5% decline, and you have FUD. Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt. This initiates panic buying of Oil futures. Oil supply then appears to be short as less is available until the month of use. Peoiple bid movre for that oil and the price goes up. Buyers who then have excess sell that excess at a profit and so it goes.

If you want to fix this, start with an increase of US interest rates to strengthen the dollar and bring investment out of commodities and back into US stocks and credit markets. Then the dollar will strengthen and the oil price will fall as it ceases to be an investment vehicle.

Oil producing countries, for whom oil is the bulk of their GDP, are now concerned that the price rise will cause a global retreat from oil products. This scares the shit out of them as what do Iran and Saudi have to offer the global economy other than oil and dates. If you want a quick fix......only allow actual consumers to buy oil, and lock spoeculators out of the market completely. The price would plummet. Imagine if only refiners could buy oil on the market.
 
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Phalanx,
before you get too tender about linking, just realize I wanted a link to your other forums so you would not have to re-iterate everything here for me. Just trying to make your life easier bro ;).

personally I try to vet anything I read on the internet and you are no exception. I dont know you or who you are, so you start on the same level as the 9/11 truthers, the doomsday prophesiers, random websites linked, large company executives and everyone else. No insult intended, I just need to get a feel for you and where you are coming from. There's no need for you to get your feelings hurt and be defensive. If you are going to make some significant assertions like above, then you can expect to be vetted as to your credentials, credibility and intelligence.

You dont sound like a kook to me 8)

Heres a newsflash for ya. the saudi increase wont make any difference. In nigeria MEND (terrorists) took out 320,000 barrels a day in production of light sweet crude in several attacks last week. basically the saudis are gonna increase heavy crude at a rate of ~33,000 barrels a day in a year or so. we're looking at a reduction of 10X that right now. terrorist attacks are by far the biggest threat to the steady supply of oil.

as to your field being listed as to value instead of barrels, I suppose this is a direct response to maxine waters "slip" of socializing the oil industry and some of her colleagues subsequent remarks to that effect. I can only assume that BHO would assist in that movement if he gets chosen for president.

I've been wondering why we would go into the middle east for thier oil when we have our own supplies available, but now I think that we HAD to due to our restriction to offshore drilling and ANWR drilling and lack of heavy crude refining ability here in the US. basically our own policies nationally are effecting our "foreign policy" and if we need more OIL we HAVE TO go abroad.


the mainstream news is only a tool for spreading propaganda, and are not to be given any real credibility. They are best use to see which way the discussion is being diverted while the power brokers do something completely different elsewhere.

the election and the "energy crisis" are merely diversions and build-ups to a common north american financial system being implemented as we speak. I think you got that part right.

I don't think the government is stupid enough to declare martial law. that would be the end of them for sure. I'm sure that montana and oklahoma declaring a nullification of contract might have them worried tho. I'm not sure what thier response would be, but martial law would not be the first choice nor the smart one for them, here in MT. ;)
 

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The truth is Jack ,i was telling people even here it wasn't the speculators ,I was writing that weeks ago ,and even on Saturday when Fox broke this news on Saturday 2300 hours here ,when this happened one day ahead in real time.
How did i know that? i didn't ,In fact it was to fast for me and my counter parts in Europe .
I emailed one in France until late last night ,and like she said we are not getting wrote off as kooks anymore ,and yes we all did a collective high five ,but now the ones who are doing this know they had a little Achilles heel they over looked ,and i am sure they are now on it.
Do i know how to play wall street ,NO , but after weeks of telling people it isn't the speculators and have the smart Wall Street guys tell me i am full of it ,correct me with numbers i know nothing about ,or tell their side as fact ,I had the real McCoy on my company hard drive and it didn't lie.
I woke up to 134 emails today , just like my counter parts ,but the girl in France said she was to bring in her software ,and attend a meeting in what would be her morning now.
We were right about this and now people know it ,but i cant see them allowing us to continue as normal .
The numbers and codes change daily ,but the patterns and culprits do not and that is what people need to see .
Sometimes i have been so pissed after work ,i just wanted to down load my entire hard drive onto a site like this in a PDF.
Not some News agency because you cant trust them ,but here so someone like you would damn sure know what he was seeing.
And i know you are smart ,and i know you would understand what you were reading.
But this entire site would go silent ,until someone would say ,Oh My God!!!! ,and then it would go all over the web, and i would just vanish to some jail cell some where.
But this is a site owned by Alex and he would get heat also ,along with some others.
My counter part in California is saying his pass word isn't working now ,mine still is but who knows for how long.
Jack if i could post a link i would ,or a story ,but i cant and i hope you see why now.
The speculator thing was a small fry ,the loop hole we had is going to be History now for sure ,and we couldn't have played the sock market with it ,but we sure knew why gas was as high as it was.
That isn't what i am afraid of ,even if i had made copy's of decoded reports and charts 90 days ago ,they would still tell you whats going on ,and who it was.
So this is a delicate situation ,what if someone with even an old report does what i said above ,it is still going to spill the beans.
I imagine they are coming up with something to discount that , and i wish smart guys like you ,and guys like me could have worked together a long time ago.
No i am not a conspiracy person with a tin foil hat , but i sure knew who was producing oil ,true numbers on how much ,and who was buying it , i could see leases and drilling permits ,price variations ,reserve quantity's ,you name it we saw it.
And i also knew when someone was lien their ass off ,and passing the buck.
And i saw things like this,,, Nova Mud and Crescent supply out of Houston were barging out supply's to an off shore, operating ,Drilling platform in the gulf in American waters.
I went to my locater charts ,my list of lease permits ,and field designations ,i found nothing ,American company's were not to drill there and any applications would be Denied pending Congressional approval.
Typical read out ,but even my GPS showed the Rig , I called Nova and talked to the Manager there ,we used to work together ,and i asked him WTF.
He said he would call me later at home ,he did and guess who's rig that was ????? :mad:
Let me say this ,they make your kids happy meal toys.
Three years ago ,i lived in Alaska where i ran Seismograph crews mapping out reserves in ANWR for two years .
It was there i joined my first forum ,and people were interested in what we were doing ,as i was, We felt like we were doing something great for our Country ,even freezing ,hungry ,and fighting off Mosquito's as big as wasp.
Some reserves we found were so large and deep the numbers went off our charts ,require new stronger equipment to be air lifted to us by the Air Force.
And i am telling you ,ANWR is bigger than Arabia ,and Iraq combined ,deeper reserves ,but bigger.
And we never completed the project ,we got the drift here.
Mickey ,forget the speculators they are not shit ,and it isn't the oil company's ,if they post a profit that the Media tells you is huge .
That really isn't profit come next year ,it is used up in Exploration ,Building Off Shore Platforms and ships ,Equipment ,Employee medical and retirement the list goes on.
Guys do not fall into that trap !!! last night we blew the speculator lie apart ,then it was the Arabs ,now we are back to the evil Oil Company's.
Man i give up ,I cant believe people who bitch about what they hear the Media ,and web links say about guns ,believe it all about oil.
I can see even if i did rat this out with my hard drive ,or make it a link so people would believe it ,they would still be coming up with something and believe what the Government told them.
I'm outta here.
 

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It is so simple ,THINK!!!
Speculators ,with the amount of oil we are talking about ,That would be an Army of Speculators ,and if they were making this kind of money it would be hard to hid it . And if it were them why hasn't this happened before ? a speculator is a smart guy ,he didn't just grow a brain over night ,and clone himself in the Millions .if it were them then these country's suffering would be hunting them down with shot guns.
The Saudis ,these guys have got to be crapping in their pants ,because out of all the oil producing country's in the World it is they who are in the cross hairs. And like they said ( Why in hell would i have any desire to cripple America to the point her economy collapses ? who the hell is going to protect us then ? we are a little Country ,without America we would be invaded within 24 hours .
And from what i see of the rest of the world we no longer would be a Sovereign Nation ,or people ,and would be refugee's wandering in the Desert).
Big OIL , Ok i am big oil ,but i am American big oil ,trying to compete on a Global stage with my hands tied behind me by my own country . And why do people think because i post a large profit one year ,that that goes in my pocket ? when in fact it is what i use the next year to operate.
Equipment ,salary's ,pensions ,Medical care ,wages ,the list goes on and no one asks me how much of last years profit do i have left !!!
No one in the Media or our Government tells you that !!
And being America why in the world would i stand by and watch my own Country fall apart because i want to (STUPID) .
If my country falls apart where the hell am i going to go ? and if that happened then all the Money i seemingly have would be worthless.
As a Public Company i cant invest it in Gold ,or Euros ,I own interest in GM ,or Ford ,why do i want my own interest to fail?
I live in America ,people know where to find me , and i am not so ignorant as to cut off my nose in spite of my face.

Exactly : the ones people pass around as the cause of this ,either cant do this ,or really have no motive.
I can think of two that are big enough to do this and they do have a motive , and they sit and laugh watching us run around pointing fingers and the Kiss Ass Media is the Holy Disciple of the word.
Like i said ,every thing i hear as an explanation is to small to have this impact in one year other than a World War.
And everywhere i look ,it is this reason or that reason ,or there is a shortage or there isn't a shortage even on the Media outlets.
You throw enough BS out there and it takes time for people to dig out of it.
And i am really worried about Americans ,the people they put in the running for president at a time we need a real inspiring Leader.
Instead of those who's only solution is to remove our rights ,and walk into Congress every day and instead of working on the problems, sit around and Ban about everything they can.
Or we run around like we are on a witch hunt ,and when we cant find one we make one up.
Instead of sitting back and thinking ,Wait a minute ,lets approach this constructively ,thinking the simplest solution is usually the answer.
Who would benefit from this the most on this scale ? why can i not believe it is who i am being told ,and deduce why.
Who would have the resources to pull this off ? something this size ,would take one very big player ,little players would be fighting with each other. Who could hide their movements the best . America at one time thought like this.
 

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Lets say I am a speculator. I buy 100,000 barrels of oil at 132. The next bidder asks 132, the buyers trying to get that oil bid against each other and move the price to 133 ans so on. I've seen a $3bn corporation stock price fall by 3% just as a result of ten 300-1200 share trades in a row. Learn how the markets function. Remember the first trader who bought oil at $100 per barrel. He bid $100 for a block of 1000 barrels, when the market was at $98, just to be the first. This small bid pushed the price to $100 and it took several hours for the price to return to 98/99.

Go look at pricing on a stock like IBM and see how small the trades need to be to shift a price. Speculators don't need to spend tens of billions to move the oil market price. Also If I take out options contracts I can tie up oil without actually having to buy any. Lets say I buy an option on 1M barrels for November 2008 delivery. That contract might cost me $1M. But if my option is for oil at $134 and in November the price is $140, I exercise sell my option and sell the same day at $140 and clear $5M with only a $1M risk. Because I exercise my option and sell in the same day, at the end of day settlement I get a cheque for the $5M. I never actually have to part with the $134M to buy the oil. But that 1 million barrels of oil was off the market until I sold it. Get it yet......I tied up 1M barrels, made $5M profit with only a $1M spend.

Exxon made $38Bn, but is only investing $10Bn in it's exploration and infrastructure. They have stated that their production capacity will fall by 2.5% over the next few years. Exxon intends to use the reset to pay shareholder dividends and also buy back the company's public stock. If this continues it will go back to being a private company. Are you not reading their financial reports. What planet have you been living on....... when they go private their accounts no longer have to be made public. Have you been on vacation or just living on Mars. Why do they do it...greed. The CEO wants to make hundreds of millions in bonus payments. The same reason as the housing bubble and most other financial scams. GREED. When the CEO has $200M in cash and a $10M per year pension, why should he give a shit about the poor, he won't be one of them. Don't assume the rich are as patriotic as the poor. Patriotism is a tool of manipulation often used by governments of the wealthy to direct the lower and middle classes.

Saudi Arabia is concerned because the price of oil is causing people and countries to reevaluate their oil dependence. If Americans get out of their trucks and SUVs, reduce their driving and seek alternate power sources, And the world follows, the demand for oil will fall and Saudi Arabia's only real asset becomes some worthless puddle of shit, then they are fucked. they haven't in a future without oil in the same way Dubai or Kuwait have, they spend as fast as they earn. No oil demand and they have nothing. That is why they are worried. A price backlash could cripple them. Saudi Arabia produces around 9M of the 85M barrels consumed per day. Who the hell do you think produces the other 76M barrels, what about them?

I'm tired, and going to sleep.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Saudi Arabia is concerned because the price of oil is causing people and countries to reevaluate their oil dependence. If Americans get out of their trucks and SUVs, reduce their driving and seek alternate power sources, And the world follows, the demand for oil will fall and Saudi Arabia's only real asset becomes some worthless puddle of shit, then they are fucked. they haven't in a future without oil in the same way Dubai or Kuwait have, they spend as fast as they earn. No oil demand and they have nothing. That is why they are worried. A price backlash could cripple them. Saudi Arabia produces around 9M of the 85M barrels consumed per day. Who the hell do you think produces the other 76M barrels, what about them?
Sounds about right. No oil producing nation has a real interest in alienating the USA. Americans being Americans, when pushed, we innovate. Through our innovation we can reduce demand by some means. We never had the incentive like we do currently.
 

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23 June 2008: Crude's rise came as Congress held hearings today on the impact of speculators on energy markets. Speculators now control about 70% of contracts for energy futures, up from 37% in 2000. Many critics have charged that the low margin levels required on many contracts has pulled in investors who otherwise might be shut out of the market. If Congress limited the speculation, four energy analysts told lawmakers, the price of gasoline would drop to a gallon in 30 days.
Not sure it would drop that much, but there would be a very nice downward turn. Margin trading, futures and options contracts allow a small number of people to have a big effect on markets.

Phalanx, the comment about profits earned one year being used to run the business next year is wrong. I just checked Exxon's last year numbers. Profit, is what a company makes when it takes it's incomming revenue, subtracts it's running costs and expenses. Exxon takes in $434Bn. Yes, four hundered and thirty four BILLION dollars. Take away operating costs, expenses and capital investment depreciation and you end up with gross profit. Take away tax and it is left with $42Bn net profit. Cash in the bank. Salaries, pensions, medical care etc is all covered under SG&A costs and that has already been taken out before the profit figure was announced. $42.2Bn NET profit.

.....and the idea that Saudi can increase its production by 30% at the drop of a hat. They are currenty pushing 9.7M barrels a day. Their max capacity at the moment is a shade over 10M. They are investing huge sums of money to up this to 12M over the next few years.

As a public company you can invest in anythng you want. Your responsibility is not to the country but to the shareholders. You seek to maximize profit thoguth growth and cost control. Evry time you invst capital you ask yourself "is this the best use of these funds?" and "Is there a better use that will generate increased gain?" not how do I help the poor, or "oh, fuck it, it's only a billion". What production company, in its right mind would support spending money to reduce the value of it's product. The CEO wouldn't be there long if he thought like that. Have you noticed all the new Exxon TV adds, to try and make people think they aren't the bad guys. It is interesting to note that they are talking about all these new technologies and spending to increase production when their company report shows that they are reducing production volume and that they are spending more money to buy themselves into a private firm than finding oil or generating alternatives.

WAKE UP!
 
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