[aziator]

These guys are the reason so many people don't like LEO. The few bad apples that give the rest a bad name. Enjoy

http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2009/01/leo_in_need_of.php

 

[1redgmc]

AZ - there is about 20 minutes of combined video out there on YouTube for this traffic stop, and in this final video clip...

... the cops tell the driver that had he identified himself as a CCW holder (presented his card) and had he notified them he was carrying a pistol - they may have had a different attitude with him.

The one cop asked him what kind of pistol it was and the driver said he 'didn't know' - and that he 'just got it about a week ago' and 'never shot it'.

I (personally) think in this case, the cops were justified in their actions and the driver was just another punk who thinks he was hassled for no reason.

What do the rest of you think? Am I reading it wrong?

 

[wristlock]

I read a few of the comments on Youtube and Arms and the Law. A lot of people wanted these LEOs fired,sued or prosecuted. Non of this would happen. The cops were justified in pulling their guns. Simply, they felt threatened.

In Georgia you do not have to notify an officer that you are carrying. But it is a good idea.

Cops not knowing the law or confusing it with laws in another state is not uncommon.
When I lived in Florida, way back when cell phones were big, someone call the cops on a friend of mine. They said he was carrying exposed at a pay phone outside a store. It was his cell phone they saw. He has a CCW and his gun was in his car. The cops got all upset that he carried without a holster. In GA you have to use a holster or hip grip. Florida has no holster requirement.

Advice: When cops say you can go, then STFU and leave.

 

[1redgmc]

Advice: When cops say you can go, then STFU and leave.

My thoughts exactly! His tongue sure seems to get loose when the cuffs come off.

 

[aziator]

I didn't watch the last 9 min video. The truth is the cops down in Glynn county (south I95) have a bad habit of harassing people with CCW, especially open carry. This is not the first incident like this. I don't doubt that the officers felt threatened by a kid with both hands on the wheel calmly talking to them. It is their overall unprofessional actions that has sparked the debate. Back in 2003 there was a guy killed by cops during a traffic stop due to the cop not practicing finger control (finger on the trigger when he didn't intent to shoot and his finger "slipped"). GA has such awful laws when it comes to CCW that even the cops don't know what they are and they are supposed to be the professionals.

Tylenol as a narcotic?

Would they do the same if my wife was carrying with the 4 kids in the back? That is what you have to ask yourself. You are not required to tell them you are carrying and the guy in the truck didn't make any threatening gestures.

Me, I don't preach that everyone should Open carry, it usually ends up like this for people. But they do have that right and cops need to learn the laws.

 

[Northwesterner]

These cops were total jerks. A lot of powertripping going on there. The only "smart mouths" I heard was coming from the two idiots with badges. The kid was pretty damn subdued through the whole thing.

 

[sinjin]

Advice: When cops say you can go, then STFU and leave.

Or else ... what, exactly? I don't think I like were you're going with this. Law enforcement officers are servants of the people, including the snot nosed smart asses. They are fellow citizens who have voluntarily accepted the responsibility of protecting the public and enforcing the law. The officer on the left appeared way to casual, to my eye, despite the threats he was issuing, and the hand gun he was waving around, to convince me he felt particularly threatened. The officer on the right saw the pistol first, and didn't seem overly alarmed. Certainly didn't draw his weapon and start threatening to, how did his excitable partner so eloquently put it, "blow your f**king head off"? How professional. How respectful. (heart swelling with pride and admiration) What was I thinking? Of course, you guys are exactly right! That officer was displaying the kind of high moral fibre and level head all law enforcement officers should strive for! Without fine officers like that, the deadly and pernicious burned out plate light scourge would have reached epidemic proportions by now! [end sarcasm] My take on this? Officer Barney Cartman, there, decided he didn't like that smart mouthed punk and, when it became clear that the kid was carrying, he used it, and his badge, and his gun, as an excuse to vent and make that kid "respect his atharatai!" Good thing he had his bullet in his gun, that night.

 

[Northwesterner]

I agree. Granted cops have to deal with some real smart asses but then sometimes what they take for a smart mouth just means he doesn't think he's getting his ass kissed fast enough. I got pulled over for having my license plate light out and I swear this cop thought he was auditioning for "Real Stories of the Highway Patrol". He was taking himself so seriously that I started chuckling and just couldn't stop. I'm sure he thought I was a smart ass but he didn't have to be such a dumb ass and blow the thing all out of proportion. Sometimes they just need to chill out.

 

[aziator]

All I know is I am checking all my license plate lights as soon as I get home. That and I may try to organize a nice Saturday Open Carry Motorcycle ride down that way. There are some nice roads to ride leisurely down there.

 

[TEXAS SOLFTAIL]

THOSE COPS WERE WAY OUT OF LINE, THEY SHOULD BE FIRED! IF THAT WAS MY SON, I WOULD BE PISSED!

 

[1redgmc]

No one cares that the driver had no idea what kind of pistol he had, and that he never shot it? ???

Now I am NOT defending the fact that the cops seem to have over-reacted, but there are definitely faults on BOTH sides of this incident. :2cents:

 

[aziator]

Yes, there are probably faults on both sides. Bottom line, one side was completely out of line. The snot nosed punk was still pretty calm and collected for the most part. Not everyone is gun savvy. He may have bought that from a friend and by the looks of it had it is a uncle mikes $10 holster. It was still within his legal rights to have a gun on his person, even if he didn't know what it was.

That county has a bad habit of stirring up trouble. Even after Georgiacarry.org (GCO) sent them a letter detailing the new laws and trying to educate them they just blew them off. They basically told GCO they would interpret and enforce the laws the way they see fit.

Not saying that the victim didn't do things wrong, just that the police went overboard. I would have been arrested that night right after they took my nighthawk custom away and threw it down on the bed of the truck. Right then and there I would have asked them to go ahead a book me because I wasn't saying another word until I had a lawyer present. I like to think that I would own that police dept. right now but of course I get aggravated and talk smack. Those guys are out of line and if I were a chief of Police/sheriff I would have both of those guys running the radio back at the station. They can trade off, 12 hour shifts every day until they quit.

 

[sinjin]

No one cares that the driver had no idea what kind of pistol he had, and that he never shot it? ???

Yes I care, but that has absolutely nothing to do with the behavior of that police officer, who, in fact, did nothing to try and convince the kid to rectify his ignorance. Rather, he challenged the appropriateness of him having such a weapon regardless of the circumstances. He could just as easily have given that patronizing speech to you, without regard to how l33t you're handgun skills might be. How about "Please keep your hands on the steering wheel. Do you have a permit to carry that weapon?" and "I respect your right to carry that pistol, but it would be safer and more effective if you developed some skill with it. I recommend a training course with .... ". Regardless of what the kid initially said that pissed the officer off, I think the officer could have executed his duty to the community he serves much more safely and effectively by pursuing a civil and constructive discourse instead of "flexing" his authority to try and teach him some sort of lesson. That officer's reaction went way beyond simple caution, and was unnecessarily confrontational, at best, and down right abusive, at worst. It was the actions of the officer that escalated the tension and the danger level.

 

[MickeyC]

If they worked for me, the primary officer who pointed the gun and spoke the most would be fired and the other disciplined for being a party to the actions and for not reporting them himself later.

I don't care how dangerous their job is, they should still obey the laws and procedures they are required to. If they don;t like the job as it is supposed to be carried out, change jobs. They give good LEOs a bad name and make their job harder.

 

[Northwesterner]

No one cares that the driver had no idea what kind of pistol he had, and that he never shot it? ???

Not really, no. Once while visiting friends from out of state I was staying at a hotel downtown and couldn't bring my own gun along on the trip. He lent me his .38 revolver. Until I got back to the hotel, all I knew was it was loaded and it was a .38. Never shot it and if he told me the brand I didn't give it much thought at that moment. Just because someone can't answer some irrelevant questions doesn't mean he's doing anything wrong.

 

[1redgmc]

So no one thinks those cops should be promoted and given the keys to the city?

Dang, you guys are hard core.

I do however, enjoy seeing everyone spun up a little - and think it is good to debate stuff like this instead of being stuck on one topic (like politics) all the time. I'm just having some fun with y'all... you too AZ... ;D

Hope I didn't yank your chains too hard.

Yeah, those cops were way out of line, and that idiot put the driver at risk when the situation did not appear to warrrant such aggressive actions. I will concede that since I was not there, nor did I witness what led to the traffic stop, nor could I hear everything that was said amongst them - I will not pass judgement on either party - but am inclined to believe it would warrant additional review and subsequent administrative actions.

However, I seem to recall (without going back to watch it again) - the officer on the passenger side having his weapon drawn too. I seem to remember him having to holster his sidearm at one point when he was at the rear of the truck. Dang it, now I gotta go back and watch it again. :duh:

I also consider myself lucky, to have had the pleasure of coming into contact with more than reasonable LEO's - especially one night when I was forced to hold a young man (who was breaking into my car at 3AM) at gunpoint until the State Trooper arrived.

There is more to the story, but here is the short version...

I was standing in the road, gun drawn on the guy, when the trooper rolls up beside me. He puts his passenger window down and calmly asks me what is going on. I tell him that I caught this guy and two others breaking into my car.

He calmly says, 'OK, I'll take it from here...' and proceeds to take control of the situation.

When it was all said and done, I had (4) WV State Troopers in front of my house, who had all three suspects in custody.

They each shook my hand and thanked me for my efforts, and when it came time for the report - I was politely told that the initial suspect was rather upset that I had drawn my weapon on him - and the trooper said he had no idea what he was talking about, because when he rolled up - he "...saw no gun..."

I nodded quietly and filled out the incident report...

These troopers were not all ate up with glory, were appreciative of my own calm demeanor and they obviously felt no need to complicate matters further by making an issue of me standing in the middle of the road with a gun drawn on someone.

I wish there were more LEO's out there like that - and suspect the Georgia guys are the exception and not the norm. :2cents:

 

[Northwesterner]

I do however, enjoy seeing everyone spun up a little - and think it is good to debate stuff like this instead of being stuck on one topic (like politics) all the time. I'm just having some fun with y'all... you too AZ...

I guess I do get spun up a little but I don't take any of this personally. I never forget we are first and foremost here to enjoy our common interest in guns, but like you said, nothing wrong with a little lively debate to spice it up.

 

[aziator]

You are correct, The guy on the right had his hand on his gun the whole time and pulled it out after seeing the gun. He kept it at his side, almost out of sight i believe. I can't go back and watch, internet over here is too slow to do that again.

Don't worry about me, my chain is real long and gets yanked quite a bit, I am used to it.

 

[TEXAS SOLFTAIL]

NO CHAIN YANKED HERE. JUST PUT YOURSELF IN THE BOYS SHOES, BEING STOPPED FOR A TRAFIC VIOLATION & A LEO ENDS UP PULLING HIS GUN & TELLING YOU HE IS GOING TO BLOW YOUR F;;;ING HEAD OFF. I WOULD HAVE SH*T. SAW A NEWS CLIP THE OTHER MORNING WHERE A KID GOT SHOT IN THE BACK, ON THE GROUND, UNARMED, AT POINT BLANK BY AN OVER REACTIVE OFFICER ON NEW YEARS EVE. HE WASN'T AS LUCKY AS THE BOY IN THE TRUCK.

 

[Northwesterner]

SAW A NEWS CLIP THE OTHER MORNING WHERE A KID GOT SHOT IN THE BACK, ON THE GROUND, UNARMED, AT POINT BLANK BY AN OVER REACTIVE OFFICER ON NEW YEARS EVE

Since you mentioned it, here it is