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So, lets say for arguments sake the AWB comes back online in the future...more than likely weapons made before the ban date will be "pre-ban" and probably legal. So my question is...

Will you still be able to have the same configuration? Like 30 round mag, bayonette lugs...folding/collapsing stocks? This applies to the pre-ban gun only.


Also, now i'm having a nightmare where "the choosen one" signs an executive order before I get my XCR in my hands...will i be out of luck? Wouldn't that be great paying $1700 for a gun that can't leave the factory..lol

And does anyone know if serial'd lowers count as "pre-ban" in stripped form? Or do you need to have a complete rifle assembled to be "pre-ban" ?
 

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So, lets say for arguments sake the AWB comes back online in the future...more than likely weapons made before the ban date will be "pre-ban" and probably legal. So my question is...

Will you still be able to have the same configuration? Like 30 round mag, bayonette lugs...folding/collapsing stocks? This applies to the pre-ban gun only.


Also, now i'm having a nightmare where "the choosen one" signs an executive order before I get my XCR in my hands...will i be out of luck? Wouldn't that be great paying 00 for a gun that can't leave the factory..lol

And does anyone know if serial'd lowers count as "pre-ban" in stripped form? Or do you need to have a complete rifle assembled to be "pre-ban" ?
Hard to say how the new ban will be worded. I can about guarantee it will be broader and stricter than the last one. The Anti-Christ won't leave any loopholes in this one. There maybe nothing left to grandfather. As far as stripped lowers go, during the last awb they had to be a complete assembled lower with an attached complete upper PRIOR to the awb giong into effect. It was easy enough to check serial numbers as far as when the stripped lower was made. It got to be quite a grey,contended area though to prove that the gun was completely assembled prior. You can bet that will be one of the loopholes closed off on the next ban.
 

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I think if we read the news today and pay attention to the things he is already using his power to solve. We are in for a scary ride to say the least. He has stated time and time again he isn't going to take our guns. He has said nothing about making it so hard to legally own one that we can't. Or that ammo accountability http://www.ammunitionaccountability.com/ will be so difficult that you can't afford to shoot. New president in different times. People have a different attitude. This attack will be something totally different and will catch the most savy gun owners by surprise.
 

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It is all speculation now. Like the others have said, it will be a tougher ban this time. It would be nice it they kept the wording the same as far as "evil" features, who needs a bayonet lug? I have just about all the lowers I need right now so life should be good. Primers, powder and a good lead melting pot should be priority I think.
 

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And eventhough there are probably 20 times more "evil rifles" out there than during the '94 ban the folks will screw each other over on prices again. RSR sold out of over 3000 AR receivers of various manufacturers in one week after the election. That's one distributor. Many of those went to a "legitimate" dealers that sold them to customers, business as usual. The rest? Hoarding, waiting for a ban so they can sell them for 4-5 times profit. Bushmaster did that to folks that had existing orders already paid for. They canx'd them and sent the customers a form letter stating they needed to send more money to get their rifle/lower and that their decision to raise the price was supported by some judge.

It's hard to speculate about a ban without knowing what is being brought to the table. His official statement was to make the '94 ban permanent. Realistically that ban was toothless after everyone figured out to get around it, it was all aesthetics based.
 

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AWB is here and didn't take long...

http://www.whitehouse.gov/agenda/urban_policy/

Quote:
Address Gun Violence in Cities: Obama and Biden would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama and Biden also favor commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals. They support closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. They also support making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent.
 

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Seriously, who the hell knows? There is no bill with language to review. Since there is no bill, its impossible to answer this question
 
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If i were the evil gun banner here's what I would do.

1- create AWB that banned transfer or manufacture of any semiauto rifle or pistol, and mags over 10 rounds by dealers (via atf rule changes) or private sales (via legislation)
2- stop private sales of guns entirely
3- stop importation of ammo from russia and others, and all surplus ammo sales as dangerous
4- declare the saiga-12 as a destructive device
5- require registration of all assault weapons by 2012. stretching it out means a higher compliance and time for folks to get used to the idea.
6- start making public examples of folks right up front. there would be massive raids and prosecutions for the first year.
7- grandfathered weapons could never be transferred unless registered, nad magazines would be treated the same way.
8- stop all importation of small arms entirely.
9- increase fees and taxes on ammo and firearms manufacturing inside the USA.
10- require licensing of all gun owners who store thier weapons at their homes


all the above actions would be 100% in line with the Heller ruling too.
 

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And this is why I laugh at the hoarders who are not enthusiasts or collectors. Buying guns (and parts) MIGHT be a good financial investment, but all it takes to take away the profit is banning the transfer. It's that easy. If the .gov wanted to hit the gun community hard, that's all that they would have to do.

I buy all my guns for keep sakes, something to pass down to my children, their children, etc. Hopefully there is some kind of heirloom/family pass down exception.

If i were the evil gun banner here's what I would do.

1- create AWB that banned transfer or manufacture of any semiauto rifle or pistol, and mags over 10 rounds by dealers (via atf rule changes) or private sales (via legislation)
2- stop private sales of guns entirely
3- stop importation of ammo from russia and others, and all surplus ammo sales as dangerous
4- declare the saiga-12 as a destructive device
5- require registration of all assault weapons by 2012. stretching it out means a higher compliance and time for folks to get used to the idea.
6- start making public examples of folks right up front. there would be massive raids and prosecutions for the first year.
7- grandfathered weapons could never be transferred unless registered, nad magazines would be treated the same way.
8- stop all importation of small arms entirely.
9- increase fees and taxes on ammo and firearms manufacturing inside the USA.
10- require licensing of all gun owners who store thier weapons at their homes


all the above actions would be 100% in line with the Heller ruling too.
 

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Seriously, who the hell knows? There is no bill with language to review. Since there is no bill, its impossible to answer this question
Actually there is a draft bill called H.R. 45. Here is a link. I have the pdf if anybody wants it.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.45: Sorry I tried this link and realized it didn't work, here is an alternate

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:h45ih.txt.pdf


Regards
 

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Seriously, who the hell knows? There is no bill with language to review. Since there is no bill, its impossible to answer this question
Yeah but it is nice to play speculation sometimes.

Here is my guess:

1) Instead of having a "banned list", they will now have an "approved list," and only those on the approved list will NOT be considered "assault weapons." All these approved weapons will have a Gov't stamp. If the approval stamp gets worn off, you go to jail. How is the Gov't suppose to know that it was legally approved without the stamp?

2) For those that bought assault weapons legally before the banned was enacted, they will be given a certain amount of time to register them. One year! If you fail to register it, then you go to jail. Even if the Gov't screws up your paperwork, you go to jail, because nothing is ever the Gov'ts fault.

3) It will cost you money to register each weapon, and since our Gov't does not have any money, they will make us pay for it all. Even if they screw up your paperwork, they will make you pay for each screw up that they do.

4) "Assault weapons" will now have a new class, not quite NFA, but one below it. So each time you sell it, you must do transfer paperwork and the new buyer will have to pay for this "transfer" just like we do with NFA items now. If you don't fill out the paperwork properly, you go to jail.

5) Spare parts will still be available for these "assault weapons" but they will cost a pretty penny, and you will need to acquire a special "assault weapons" card just to buy spare parts. The Gov't will charge you about $200 a year for this card. If you lose your card you go to jail because you made it easier for the bad guy to buy spare parts.

6) you will have to pay a 5 cent tax for each round these assault weapons shoot. "Deadly" rounds such as 7.62x51 NATO, 5.56 NATO, 7.62x39 Soviet, 50 BMG, .338 LAPUA, 7.62x54R Soviet, and/or any round that is used by any Army will be considered "assault rounds" and will all be taxable. Less "deadly" rounds such as a 30-06 will not be taxed because these rounds are relics and only used for sporting. If you cannot account for each and every assault round, you go to jail.

7) you must register and pay for the registration of each and every mag you own regardless of how many rounds it holds. Only those mags with the Gov't approval stamp will not have to registered. If you cannot account for all your mags, you go to jail because they are likely to land in the hands of a bad guy. If you the paperwork for these approved mags gets burned in a fire, you go to jail because you were not responsible, and irresponsible people belong in jail.

8 ) you must register and pay for the registration of all scopes that have a BDC or mildot, these will be considered "assault scopes" because they make the shooter more accurate. Only scopes without reticles will NOT be considered assault scopes. If you are found putting reticles on your scope, it will be considered a felony and punishable up to 50 years in jail.

9) you must register and pay for the registration of all bipods. Bipods makes shooters more accurate and we can't have that. Eventually the Gov't will make you register all sandbags too because someone will figure out sanbags are even more effective then bipods. If you are found to have possesion of un-registered sandbags, you go to jail.

10) you must register and pay for the registration of all bayonets, ofcourse now we are getting into the realm of knives and how do you separate knives from bayonets? so the Gov't will then have an approve knife list. There will be classes of knives such as "kitchen" or "sporting" knives, all other knives will be considered assault knives or bayonets. While cooking dinner for a bunch of guest, your aunt was put behind bars for 3 years because someone reported she used an assault knife for the preparation of dinner. Who cares if the knife was a family hand me down and 50 years old. She failed to be a responsible citizen by register the assault knife, so she deserves to go to jail.

11) you must register and pay for the registration of all NV equipment. Camera's and Telescopes that also happen to have NV capabilities will be ok because there will be an approved list of NV equipment. The Government will have a hard time trying to figure out what is "legal" and "illegal" so they will just put everyone that has NV equipment in jail, just to be on the safe side, because our Gov't is here to protect us.

12) you must register and pay for the registration of all Body Armour equipment. If you happen to skateboard, MX, or snowboard, you must make sure your protective gear is registered because it was found the kevlar weaving for these equipment can also stop the bullets of Government troops. The Government does not want ordinary citizen to be protected, just in case they have to shoot you, like the Gov't troops did at the students of Tianamen Square. If you are a SCUBA diver and wear shark armour, and did not properly register the armour, you will go to jail because you might be using it in a robbery.
 

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EC I'll go you one better,any military chambering,past or present will be on the "taxed ammo" list.So your 30-06 will be in their too,along with a boatload of others.
 

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If i were the evil gun banner here's what I would do.

1- create AWB that banned transfer or manufacture of any semiauto rifle or pistol, and mags over 10 rounds by dealers (via atf rule changes) or private sales (via legislation)
2- stop private sales of guns entirely
3- stop importation of ammo from russia and others, and all surplus ammo sales as dangerous
4- declare the saiga-12 as a destructive device
5- require registration of all assault weapons by 2012. stretching it out means a higher compliance and time for folks to get used to the idea.
6- start making public examples of folks right up front. there would be massive raids and prosecutions for the first year.
7- grandfathered weapons could never be transferred unless registered, nad magazines would be treated the same way.
8- stop all importation of small arms entirely.
9- increase fees and taxes on ammo and firearms manufacturing inside the USA.
10- require licensing of all gun owners who store thier weapons at their homes


all the above actions would be 100% in line with the Heller ruling too.

I disagree that all of these would be allowable under Heller.

Heller holds that there is an individual right to keep and bear arms, both for the purpose of self-defense, and for the purpose of participating in a citizens' militia. It also endorses the Miller decision, and affirms that citizens have the right to own weapons suitable for use in a militia. Anything that can be shown to substantively infringe on that is unconstitutional.

Heller might, or might not, allow for licensing. It won't protect the importation of arms. But it definitely rules out #1. It will take a court challenge to prove it, but you can't ban high-cap weapons: They're needed for the militia. Under Miller, the first AWB was unconstitutional, but NOBODY CHALLENGED IT, so it stood.

As to the restrictions on ammo, you're probably right: they can get away with a great deal there.

They'll go after 50-caliber weapons, claiming the Heller exemption on "unusual weapons." Again, that will be settled in court.

Hard to class the Saiga 12 as a destructive device, because it's just a shotgun. They might claim it's an "unusual weapon."

And if the implementation of an AWB is met with a court challenge, the challengers will almost certainly get an injunction until the Supremes weigh in. And I don't think Scalia would be amused.

I'm not saying there's nothing to worry about. It's going to be rocky. But Heller tilts it all in our favor.

tk
 

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I guarantee there will be calls and possibly attempts during B.ody O.ders presidency to repeal the second amendment.
 

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OK I have read the dreaded "EXECUTIVE ORDER" thing for the last time.

I am telling you that the President CANNOT, I repeat cannot, implement any ban on any weapons made in the US with an EO. Do a search for "executive order US" and read the wiki page in a google search. You will actually learn something about the political system and the whole 3 branches thing.

An EO is an administrative tool for the President to instruct federal agencies on internal procedural matters. NOT LAWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ONLY CONGRESS CAN PASS LAWS. Yes the President can veto but congress can override him. The President cannot make laws.

I do not trust the almighty O as much as the next XCR lover. With that said, just think about the number of gun owners in America. Just think about what the AWB did to the dems who voted for it in 1994. They were voted out of office by large margins. Even Clinton acknowledged this in his 1996 inauguration address. There is a good reason that congress did not try to prevent it from expiring in 2004; it meant political suicide.

Now back to my previous point on how many Americans own "Assault Weapons"? Currently an estimated twenty to thirty million own the firearms covered by the broader definitions of "assault weapon."

20 - 30 million Americans is a HUUUUUGE voting block by any definition. :eek: It would be huge political suicide even for the lord high Barack. You must learn to discern between political posturing and what they will actually do. I think you all would be AMAZED by the number of democrats who are pro 2nd amendment. Banning semi-auto rifles and even worse banning all semi-autos would be the end of his presidency and their congressional rule. They didn't do it in 2004 and they will not do it anytime soon.

So stop with the fear mongering about the next AWB. It may come in the future but not during this term.

Sirously people stop freaking out. I agree you shouldn't wait longer than you need to to buy an XCR or any other rifle, pistol or what have you. The more there are the harder it is to eliminate.
 
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OK I have read the dreaded "EXECUTIVE ORDER" thing for the last time.

I am telling you that the President CANNOT, I repeat cannot, implement any ban on any weapons made in the US with an EO. Do a search for "executive order US" and read the wiki page in a google search. You will actually learn something about the political system and the whole 3 branches thing.
This of course is true.

he can however instruct the various and sundry federal agencies to issue rulings that can

-stop importation of just about anything
- declare certain imported firearms to be in a different class of weapon (saiga 12 is a prime example as was the street sweeper before it)
-increase federal prosecutions of certain laws
-declare ammunition to be an explosive and thus subject to federal explosive handling and storage and purchasing limitations.

trust me he could do a lot administratively if he wants to.
 

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This of course is true.

he can however instruct the various and sundry federal agencies to issue rulings that can

-stop importation of just about anything
- declare certain imported firearms to be in a different class of weapon (saiga 12 is a prime example as was the street sweeper before it)
-increase federal prosecutions of certain laws
-declare ammunition to be an explosive and thus subject to federal explosive handling and storage and purchasing limitations.

trust me he could do a lot administratively if he wants to.
Dead nutz Jack,couldn't have said it better.
 

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I think that no matter how you dissect and debate the issues, we still have much to be concerned with.

The economy went to shit, the housing market imploded, gas prices went through the roof (and are climbing again), businesses are failing and we have a guy in the White House that is executing political changes with storm trooper tactics.

We worry about our Second Amendment rights (as we should!) and the seemingly humorous scenarios above could indeed be closer to reality than what we think.

The cost of ammunition has already doubled, and if I am an example of the average citizen, my ability to go have fun has been reduced dramatically. I had no problem going out and dumping 1000 rounds on a weekend but now I have to conserve ammo so I don't tap into my reserves.

This sucks
 
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