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Discussion Starter #1
I currently have an ARMS #40 rear and Troy BUIS up front. The bad thing about buying an XCR is that it is an additional cost for sights. The good thing is you can put darn near whatever you want that'll attach to rails. This is the newest rage. So any complaints about sights you'd only have to look in the mirror.

I'f I had to do it again, and I will, I will get Hk416 sights front in rear. My opinion about Back Up Iron Sights is it should not be a Back Up Iron Sights. The XCR monolithic frame allows for sights, a compact scope or red dot sight plus night vision, laser, and flashlight. If the sights are a back-up then get the most minimal BUIS you can get. Most BUIS on the market are designed for an AR which puts the sights a tad too high. They are made that way b/c the M16A3 and A4, and M4A3's have permament front sights set high to maintain the original design of the M16 with the carry handle, something no soldier has hardly ever used ever since the first M16's (we were never allowed to use the carry handle in BASIC/AIT and most infantry units). I guess it is too simple just to remove the carry handle eons ago, but oh well. To me, the high sight plane is just an inconvenience that I can live with. The XCR does allow for a lower plane and the Hk416 (actual ones) would be ideal for me since there is nothing you have to do to put the sights into action and the are just a tad higher than my ARMS #40 folded down.

I've heard that Hayes Research has a low profile HK diopter sight but it uses a center set screw to retain in place that won't work with the XCR due to the center of rails milled out.


Currently the only thing I have an optic on is my issued M4A3 w/a Acog TA31. Neat little day sight, great night illumination except that when it's dark, the only thing you'll see is the reticle.

I'll be saving my pennies for a Elcan Specter DR. You can't beat the dual magnification at a flip of a switch. Anyone that was a crew in a tank, a Bradley, or LAV25 will be familiar with that setup. I already have a PVS14 to do the night side of it.
 

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At present I am using Troy BUSI's front and rear and a Trijicon Reflex witha 4' MOA, works fine for me.
 

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Where can one find the HK416 sights?

I have a Samson Flip sight front, and a Yankee hill rear. Not totally satisfied.

My problem is not with the Samson, but the rear sight. I have been thinking about a Wilson rear with the adjustable elevation as well as windage. Any experience with this sight?

I have never been a fan of the M16, and their method for adjusting sights, in my opinion sucks. Leave the front sight alone.

I do like the co-witness capability allowed with the AR sights and such.

I am open to others experience and opinions.

Thank you.

Fred
 

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Discussion Starter #4
You can find them on Sturmgewher.com, GunBroker.com, Gordon Hill has them at hkspecialists, Centurion mades a copy to the AR heights (a tad higher than Hk's), and you can find them from time to time on eBay still. They are becoming more popular. I like to see someone copy the Sig55X sights. I'm sure they are just around the corner.
 

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I have a Samson Flip sight front, and a Yankee hill rear. Not totally satisfied.

My problem is not with the Samson, but the rear sight. I have been thinking about a Wilson rear with the adjustable elevation as well as windage. Any experience with this sight?

I do like the co-witness capability allowed with the AR sights and such.

I am open to others experience and opinions.

Thank you.

Fred
You may want to take a look at the A.R.M.S. 40L or LP to go with your Samson front, this combo works good for me on another setup that I have.
 

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The Ceturion sights are always out of stock ,i had to use troys.H&K sights on an XCR make it look like a 93 ,sort of. Ihave a 93 ,kit is becomeing old tech. But it will fire cast bullets :)
 

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Here's a close up of the rear Troy BUIS under my TA31 ACOG. Sorry about the dark picture, my digital camera was dying and I didn't have time to work it in a photo editor.



Here a slightly better perspective. You can see that it sits real low. When not folded it would be about the same height as the center of the ACOG and I have no problems with getting a good cheek weld.

 

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I am currently using a GG&G flip upBUIS, EOTech 512, and a MI flip up ft sight.
 

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I'm using the MidWest Industries front and rear BUIS on my XCR with an Eotech 512 and the set up works well for me. I can co-witness and they are very funtional should my batteries die in the Eotech.

One question..... how is the BUIS functional with the ACOG ? I guess you have to call time out and remove the ACOG if it should fail.

I'm joking about that but seriously...what do you do ?
 

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Presently, my XCR has the Knight's 600m sights on it for irons. Optics are an Aimpoint M4 and a Hensoldt magnifier (yes, the one from Larue).

The KMC sights are suberb. I'm very pleased with how they perform. Fantastic sight picture. I went with these mainly because I wanted fully usable irons--not just a backup. I also wanted the optics options, so a fully functional iron setup that folded was necessary. Only the KMC and Matech met these requirements. Matech isn't exactly easy to deal with (well, neither is KMC, but at least I'm familiar with them), so the KMC got the nod.

Optically, I had some real difficulties making a call. Eventually, I went with the M4 with a magnifier and it's looking pretty good so far. The M4 is great. The only thing I didn't care for was the killflash. That found the junk drawer pretty quickly. Too distracting for me. Otherwise, it's an Aimpoint and not much else to say. Well, the mount doesn't line up particularly well with the Larue tipoff, but that doesn't really matter too much with a magnifier. The Hensoldt is pretty good. 2.5x, it's clear, and it works. Not much else to say about it. The Larue mount, however, is very slick. That I can recomend very easily.

One issue with the QRDII mount is the knob. This puppy works very well, but sticks out quite a bit and feels quite a bit like the charging knob on the XCR. It also encroaches on the charging knob's space when the M4 is mounted over the ejection port. I'll probably replace it when the Larue M4 mount comes out, but it does work well. It's just a little too close to the charging knob and feels too much like it in eyes-off manipulation for my peace of mind. The height thing is more cosmetic and I haven't noticed it really affecting use of the magnifier.

Eventually, I plan on adding some sort of true magnifying optics. It'll probably end up coming down to the Elcan Spectre or a Schimdt and Bender flash dot. The Elcan mount's ARMS levers worry me quite a bit and that's the reason I didn't go with it initially. Probably--when funds permit!--I'll end up with the S&B on the gun for when I want a scope option. Most likely when I have it set up for 6.8mm.
 

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One question..... how is the BUIS functional with the ACOG ? I guess you have to call time out and remove the ACOG if it should fail.

I'm joking about that but seriously...what do you do ?
There's no batteries in the ACOG so nothing to fail unlike the red dots on the market like EoTech or Aimpoint. If it falls off (hard to imagine why unless you didn't tighten the mount) you just flip up the sights and keep shooting. If you're so close you don't have cover or time to flip up the sights - why would you need the sights anyway, just point and spray. The only other scenario for it failing would be to be hit with a shot fired at you. At that point, worrying about BUIS probably isn't the biggest issue, taking cover and getting the hell out of there would seem to be the highest priority.

I tried moving the ACOG forward with the BUIS both flipped up but it proved too distracting for my tastes.
 

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Interestingly enough, the service life on an ACOG's (or any tritium lit sight) is about 10 years, as compared to the 8 year battery life on the newest Aimpoint. Batteries are a good deal easier to change than tritium elements! ;D

Just a thought.
 

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So that gives me two whole years to get the Tritium replaced! The Tritium half life isn't a concern because it's not involved in daytime shooting - it only comes into play for shooting in the dark. Plus it doesn't matter if your battery isn't dead yet if you don't have time to switch it on! Just kidding. I just like the idea of not needing to ever worry about a battery or having to turn on the sight. Just mount the rifle and shoot.

As I mentioned in a previous post, I did try the ACOG a little more forward with the BUIS sights up and you can see them through the ACOG but they are in the lower part of the view area and not lined up with the red chevron. I assume that when someone says their BUIS co-locate that they mean the iron sights align perfectly with the red dot?
 

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A true cowitness would have the irons lining up with your reticle exactly. What you're seeing is usually referred to as a lower 1/3 cowitness--which is pretty much what mine is with the QRDII mount on the M4.

Although I was mostly kidding around about the tritium/battery thing, the M3 and M4 Aimpoints truely are amazing when it comes to battery life. Literally, you can load a AA into an M4, turn the thing on (actually, it's always on, unless you remove the battery), and forget about it for about 8 years on the 1-13 settings. Very slick technology, and the older M3 lasts about 5 years at similar settings. Of course, cold temperatures will impact that quite a bit, but with lithium batteries even that can be largely overcome.

Normally, you'd worry even less with tritium, but I'm getting up on 20 years in the hobby now and have worn out three sets of tritium night sights on an HK USP, a Galil AR, and a Valmet M78. Getting the latter two replaced could be an dictionary example of the word "frustration"--or "futility", heh.
 

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The only other tritium powered sights I have are on my Sig pistols. The oldest is my P239 which I've had for slightly over ten years now and the glow in the dark is still adequate although noticably dimmer than my other, newer pistols. I haven't done it yet, but I've heard you just send the sights back to Trijicon and they'll replace and ship back to you. I assume the same procedure on the ACOG.

I know battey life in some applications is quite long and 8 year service life sounds really good. My problem is I never remember when I've last replaced batteries until the device, whatever it is, stops working. In any case I'm sticking with the ACOG because of the Bindon Aiming Concept. It really works and none of the red dots have it.
 
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