[par0thead151]

will a XCR cycle sub sonic reliably when there is a suppressor on it?
with the AR platform one must mess with changing out springs and buffers, but since the XCR has a adjustable gas system, can one dial in the right setting to get subsonic ammo to function reliably in the 5.56 caliber?
thanks

 

[aziator]

Not sure anyone has tried this yet, I personally don't reload subsonic centerfire ammo.

 

[o313]

I talked to Alex about this a very long time ago and would still like to pursue this.

I will find out, PM me later.

 

[par0thead151]

if anyone does know i would greatly appreciate the info. as i am considering purchasing an XCR and this little benefit is what will convince me i "NEED" one ;D

 

[o313]

I am going to call Alex Monday and ask.

 

[Devil doc]

Look at it like this, would a .22lr have enough juice to cycle the action? Hell no! Last I talked to alex they couldn't get the 300 whisper to cycle consistantly, which really shit on my cereal. However, he did say that the pdw shorter action it would make it more feasible. With 180's you'd be making the action cycle off of a pistol catridge. Don't try the sub 5.56, your praying for a squib round and a bill from gunsmith and or a sweetass baffle strike.

 

[ExParatrooper]

will a XCR cycle sub sonic reliably when there is a suppressor on it?
with the AR platform one must mess with changing out springs and buffers, but since the XCR has a adjustable gas system, can one dial in the right setting to get subsonic ammo to function reliably in the 5.56 caliber?
thanks

TTI and EBR subsonics will not cycle the action completely with an SWR SpecWar2 or an AAC M4-2000 in my XCR.

Handloads might theoretically work, but subsonic 5.56/.223 in civilian applications is mostly a joke. With trying to tune a handload, you risk stacking rounds in the barrel, like my moron friend did, rendering that bbl. useless. The only application I can see is maybe metering tests with silencers, or simply trying to "wow" someone who's never seen a suppressed weapon before.

As far as ballistics, you might as well just suppress a .22 and be done with. It's a hell of alot cheaper and easier to find. By the time you slow a 5.56/.223 down to < 1050 fps (transonic range), you end up with a very expensive and heavy .22 that rarely ever cycles the action of a stock semi-auto.

Believe me, it's an expensive mistake to make, and the coolness will wear-off very quickly even if you can get one to cycle.

 

[o313]

Are there any 22lr's tossing an 80+ grain slug?

 

[ExParatrooper]

Are there any 22lr's tossing an 80+ grain slug?

Think the heaviest mass-produced is the Aguila subsonics @ 60gn.

Sorry, but slow and heavy isn't the way to go when talking about high-capacity carbines. It kills max effective range and penetration. The only value would be in a hollowpoint or some type of expanding sabot used inside of 75 yards. This is why you don't see mass-produced subsonics in this caliber that will cycle an action. It just doesn't make good business sense. The cost of producing a subsonic .223 is already high. Couple with that the current market conditions for .223 ammo, and this whole debate is lost before it's begun.

It would be nice to have an affordable SS .223 that would cycle the action just to play with and plink, but it just isn't happening - not in this market, anyway. Too many different variables in the semi-'s people would use them in, like having to change hammer springs, buffer and bolt carrier weights, etc.

Blowback is king when subsonic suppression is desired in a semi or full auto.

 

[Underground]

Since the effectiveness of the tiny .223 bullets is really centered around their high velocity, it doesn't seem very productive to make them deliberately subsonic. If you're popping roof rabbits in the back yard that's one thing, but then you might as well use a .22.

If you're going to slow a bullet down to subsonic speed you've limited that part of the equation. So to get the most energy out of it you're left with making the mass as large as possible. .45 would be a much better choice for that if you want to make something real quiet and still have any effectiveness.



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[o313]

Are there any 22lr's tossing an 80+ grain slug?

Think the heaviest mass-produced is the Aguila subsonics @ 60gn.

Sorry, but slow and heavy isn't the way to go when talking about high-capacity carbines. It kills max effective range and penetration.
It would be nice to have an affordable SS .223 that would cycle the action just to play with and plink, but it just isn't happening - not in this market, anyway. Too many different variables in the semi-'s people would use them in, like having to change hammer springs, buffer and bolt carrier weights, etc.

Blowback is king when subsonic suppression is desired in a semi or full auto.

There are a few reasons to want to have the ability to go almost silent. Anyone who doubts the power of a sub 1050fps 80grn can volunteer to get hit with it inside 50yds.

I wouldn't be running around with a full loadout of sub's but keeping a 20rd mag in your spare pocket would be nice. I have rolled my own subs using 75grn softpoints and they were outstanding but didn't cycle my AR.

 

[dbooksta]

I have rolled my own subs using 75grn softpoints and they were outstanding but didn't cycle my AR.

Is there no risk of baffle strikes with such loads?

I have read plenty of warnings against loading rifle cases for subsonic velocities. Do you use buffers in the powder to keep the case volume full, or do anything other than just drop a 40% powder load?

 

[o313]

I have rolled my own subs using 75grn softpoints and they were outstanding but didn't cycle my AR.

Is there no risk of baffle strikes with such loads?

I have read plenty of warnings against loading rifle cases for subsonic velocities. Do you use buffers in the powder to keep the case volume full, or do anything other than just drop a 40% powder load?

No I never used a buffer for the powder charge but I did read about a guy using malt 'o' meal for it.

As far as baffle strikes yes there is an increased risk and I know a guy that sent one into the baffles of his thunder trap. (can was fine, he shook the round out and tested accuracy with full power ammo.)

 

[dbooksta]

Are there any tables that list twist rate required to stabilize a bullet as a function of bullet diameter, weight, and muzzle velocity? I don't want to risk hurting my cans!

 

[o313]

Are there any tables that list twist rate required to stabilize a bullet as a function of bullet diameter, weight, and muzzle velocity? I don't want to risk hurting my cans!

Start by shooting without the can at close range and look for key-hole impacts.

 

[Chowwow]

Resurrecting. What brand of subsonic 5.56 ammo is best used for a suppressed XCR? I've only seen ones that do not eject from a suppressed AR-15.

 

[TTEngineer]

Why would anyone want sub sonic 5.56 or .223?

The energy must be pathetic at 1000fps.

300blk subs on the other hand cycle exceptionally well and slap with tons of energy.


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[Chowwow]

Why would anyone want sub sonic 5.56 or .223?

The energy must be pathetic at 1000fps.

Are there any 5.56 subsonic rounds that can cycle at all? Or are 5.56 guns simply engineered for that pressure to remain semi-auto?